Well, I've finally decided to begin a map building project. A word of warning, however! This project will be tackled little by little alongside my other work and activities, so you may not see a final release for a while. But yes, this is the Geonosian Arena project. I feel like I am attempting the impossible, but if you don't try, you never know, right?
Main Points
In order to build the arena, I will need the support of the community. I understand the workings of GtkRadiant now, and I feel confident I can dive into this without too many issues. But any tips about things to watch out for or avoid altogether would be MOST appreciated!
This map will mainly feature the inner ring of the arena and its intricate surrounding walls. However, as an added bonus, I will create walkways around the arena that lead out to the stadium seating, on multiple levels, as well as some rooms on the ground level that hold the warriors or prisoners to be executed, and arena beasts.
As you all know, the walls of the Geonosian Arena are composed of very intricate rock formations and eroded textures. Despite this, I don't think I will be using GenSurf too much unless I really need it for certain wall panels.
:bdroid2: What I need from all of you:bdroid2:
Please send me any reference image you can find of the arena layout, textures, walls, seating, entranceways, floors, etc. If it's a Geonosian texture, I can benefit from it!
I need some shots of the daylight skies over Geonosia.
Where in the map building process do you think I might stumble? Please let me know so I can avoid some major headaches!
Thank you all! No screenshots yet, but hopefully soon. I will begin by building the walkways around the arena.
Something to know and remember is that the arena is actually an oval, and not circular. The four pillars where prisoners are attached to are not in the center of the arena. There are also pillars off to the edge of the arena but I'm not sure how many. There appear to be quite a few gated entrances into the arena (maybe one of the entrances could be where Anakin and Padme where being held before being carted out. There are also a few large spires around the outside of the arena that would look really cool if you put them into the map (you can see them in one of the pictures). Another idea could be the box where Poggle, Dooku, Jango, and Nute were would lead into that "war" room with the large hologram showing the battle on Geonosis.
http://www.starwars.com/databank/location/geonosisarena/img/movie_bg.jpg)
http://www.starwars.com/databank/location/geonosisarena/img/eu_bg.jpg)
http://www.starwars.com/databank/location/geonosisarena/img/bts_bg.jpg)
I decided to put together a rough idea of what the arena floor looks like. The lines are entrances into the arena and the circles are pillars. The three at the bottom are where the Reek, Acklay, and Nexu came from, and the one on the left is a really large entrance. There are other entrances scattered around the edge of the arena, but I can't really pinpoint them all. Hopefully this will help you.
http://www.pe.net/~shoemake/matt/images/arena.jpg)
i've got a buch of pics, i collected them to make my sand arena look a little bit more like the geonosian arena.
i can mail them to you if you want. (if i can have your email)
be warned though! the geonosian arena is VERY complex! there are rocks hanging down almost everywere, and it's almost impossible to make the arena look like in the movie.
not to mention the fps. the place is huge! (larger than the "Sand Arena" level)
ah, but just give me your email and i'll send the pics. :)
I see the four pillars in one image, but only three in another. Was one of them removed before the execution set-up? Thanks for those pics, OCH...they are a helpful start. I saw a couple of those on Starwars.com last night but I didn't get to all of them. And thanks for going to the effort to draw a floor diagram.
I know this arena is huge! I'm hoping to "fake" a lot of the stuff that is off in the distance by doing some killer texture art on flat walls, angled at key points. This should cut down on brushes and triangles.
Also, I can't help but put a finger on my chin in thought, and lean in close to study those sky mapping techniques. Might it be possible to fake the arena walls that go straight up so high by making them a sky texture? (Note that with the clever placement of a few DO NOT ENTERs, I should be able to keep the Jedi from ever jumping up to the skybox wall.) Now, how does one build a custom skybox? Spherical cameras in Bryce?
Pakmannen, your pictures would be very helpful! Go ahead and email me at jnday@prodigy.net . I don't mind if anyone else here emails me as well, so that's why I'm posting the addy in broad daylight.
Thanks for all your help!
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EDIT:
Just got to thinking: If the skybox acts like true distant scenery, the textures may not move with the rest of the map. Hmmm..There must be a way to solve this problem. Maybe a panorama on a giant inner cylinder.
Ok. 4 pillars it is. :)
How about I give you all some eye candy? I've decided to maintain a project web site, though I will post a few screens in here as construction gets under way. But for now, please check out
http://www24.brinkster.com/jnday).
Nothing monsterous, or substantial. But at least it's something!
Those look real good i cant wait for this level :D its one of my favorite parts i episode 2 thanks for getting the idea tomake it actually look good :lol:
Thats lookin real nice man. I'm really looking forward to its completion.
Yes, sounds very good. Can't say about the looks cause the pics don't work. Ihope it's better than the ont i have!
Sounds like a very promising project!
-Lucko Mabri
Wes, what isn't working? To all of you, let me know if you have any problems. Brinkster is a pretty good service, but I'll have to move my updates to another server if I start hitting the bandwidth limit.
I'll work more on this project tonight (EST). I'll test the placement of a sliced up QTVR panorama on a few rounded inner walls. I'll need some help creating a skybox, so I'll scour the forums to see if the topic has been covered. See a later!
Wow I've never scene Bryce used so well :D
Thanks, Kranckor! Bryce is pretty powerful, but I still have trouble with the positive/negative thing that allows models to be cut into. I'll need to figure it out for this map, though.
Hey, everyone.
I didn't get to the part I wanted to get to today. I was back in Bryce trying to model the walls of the arena. From this model, I will gather my textures for the map, and several panels to be placed on extremely tall walls around the arena floor. HOPEFULLY, this will simulate the effect of being in a huge map without it being too complex. Giant walls may increase compile time for me, but hopefully gameplay will still be smooth.
It looks like the skybox issue is a no-go, however. The imagery stays at the same distance from you no matter where you are in the map. For example, if the arena walls were a sky texture, the walls would seem to be moving away from you as you moved toward them, and if you jumped up and looked down, you would see the arena floor over the edge of the solid arena floor that you walk on!
I'm leaving tomorrow for vacation, but I'll be back by Saturday night. At that point, maybe I'll just start throwing stuff into GtkRadiant to see what works. To those of you in America, have a great Independece Day.
(well, it's tomorrow for me..)
Thanks!
I hope you figure out your problem, I wish to play on this wonderful arena.
I don't really want to say this, but I almost started thinking about how great that area would be to fight in, during the movie!
Anyway, looking good!
Have a great vacation!
:emperor: I shall rule the galaxy.
Yea I will beta test it also :D :lol: well anymore updates so far?
*Clears throat*
Read my sig :D
so your sig is unorginal :lol: so hows the arena coming dude? i can't wait for this map :D
cky did you actually click that link? that is one ****ing hilarious site! :rofl:
isn't it that peanut butter jelly time thing with the dancing banana? if it is i saw that a long time ago my friend told me about it.
it is but it is my first time
Hi there! Geez, I go on vacation and we all start going bananas...or talking about them anyway. LOL. Actually, I just clicked that link, and it is funny!
Okay, as you probably guessed, I just got back from vacation now, and I'm ready to keep moving with the arena project. I'm going to alter my gray map, and continue building the model in Bryce. Also, I'll try to erect this thing in GenSurf, but I'm not sure if that will have the desired effect and playability. We'll see. If not, I'll use the completed Bryce model to grab textures, and try to piece this monster together little by little. Stay tuned.
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EDIT 7/7/02:
Small update to Bryce model. Pic available at my Brinkster site:
http://www24.brinkster.com/jnday)
Thanks to all who have offered to beta test. Once I'm to that stage, you all will get a crack at it, assuming you have various processor speeds, video cards, and memory.
Wow DaJo Kesea, i just got done looking at the bryce models. cant wait for some radiant pics. If you need any more beta testers, ill be glad to do it.
I'd be happy to beta test for you as well.
1.7 ghz
512 MB DDR Ram
GeForce 4 TI 4400 128 MB
Soundblaster Live 5.1
COOOOOOOOOOOOL. the new bryce pic blows the other bryce pic away. this is incredible. now can you convert this to jkradiant easily? how is this going to work, and pleas dont say that its just a skybox, i want to run around up there and hide behind the giant wall, and once the co-op mod comes out, maybe someone could make those 3 beasts to fight as well, and it would be a shame to not be able to fight up there. great work.
Great work!
I agree with Klorel, that a co-op mode with this map or a multiplayer game-mode where you and a bunch of your fellow Jedi Players come up against 3 of those AI monsters, each packing a ****load of hit-points and taking ages to beat. Sure would be heaps of fun!
hi i am working on this map aswel i was wondering maybe we can help each other
what do ya say?
I'd luv to test it! When its ready for testing send to lmbr24280@blueyonder.co.uk
Current Sys-
PCeleron 1gig
256mb Ram
Geforce 2 mx 400 64mb
Msi Motherboard (Forgot Exact Model)
Soon to be sys-
Amd Athlon Xp +2000
256mb DDR (2700)
Msi Geforce 4 Ti 4200 64mb
Msi K7N420 Pro Or Iwill (Forgot Model, Latest I Think)Motherboard
um, how are you planning on making this map if all there is is a model?
i'll beta!
1.33 ghz AMD Athalon
GeForce 2 PRO
i think 156mb of ram
enough beta testing askers wait TILL he actually says something about beta testing lol and that new pic looks really good dude i can not wait for this level now :D good luck with it all and are you goin to scatter droid parts around it ?
Wow...your progress is looking quite nice. It might just be me, but the walls of the arena seemed a little more red in the movie, almost a clay color. But that's something you probably can't help at this point if you're using Bryce. I am pretty sure that a decent chunk of the arena was covered and in complete shade though, but I'm guessing you're aware of that from all the reference pics you have. I'll shut up now :)
Ok, I better get my butt out of Bryce and into Radiant. I think I have what I need to get some textures on the models.
To answer some of your questions:
[list=1]
Getting the arena from Bryce to Radiant may not be easy at all. GtkRadiant (not JKRadiant) has a terrain constructor plugin called GenSurf that might work, but also might slow things down to 2fps! So we'll see. But I definitely plan on having places to fight OTHER than the arena floor, so the entire map will definitley not just be an oval surrounded by flat walls.
I don't know anything about the new co-op mod, but that sounds cool. I would love to be able to have Jedi with multicolored sabers all on the same side, set up in a skirmish. And the idea for the arena beasts sounds awesome, but right now that is beyond my abilities and amount of time I have for projects like this. If anyone wants to look into building the arena monsters, animating them, and programming their actions, let me know. I'd be glad to implement that into a single player version, or multiplayer v2.0 of this map.
Don't worry about the color too much at this point. Once I'm in Radiant and start putting up some screenies of the map, feel free to direct me in my placement of lighting so I get the proper hues for an arid, dusty, late afternoon climate.
[/list=1]
darthVADER, email me at jnday@prodigy.net, and we'll talk.
Again, thanks for all the beta tester offers. We'll get to that eventually, but you guys do have the right idea in posting your computer info. That's helpful, thanks. I'll be asking you all to raise your hands again for the job later on...just let me build it first! :D
Thanks for your all your support and your compliments about my Bryce work. The real meat has yet to come. If anyone has any more pictures of the arena, especially rare ones, please post 'em. I don't know if I can get this thing exactly like the movie, but with your help, I'll try. Here we go!
Uggh...back in school again.
My school goes year round, and I have a few night classes this quarter. I may not be able to post many updates for the next 11 weeks, but I'll keep checking here to see what you have to say. See you all soon.
just a little bit of info, terrain generators don't slow fps down that much unless you let it.
Right. Also, that arena floor is flat, all you need is some minor variation in elevation.
I'm not too worried about the arena floor elevation. (The only concern I have with that is actually making the sound of crunching/shifting sand as Kyle or another character runs on it, rather than the standard "clop clop" of boots on stone or metal.)
I wanted to use the terrain constuctor to erect the giant walls and stadium around the arena floor.
Member to make the sand area Reaaaaall Big!;)
hey DaJo I was wondering if perhaps you wanted to use my LAAT model I'm developing to put in the arena to perhaps break up the level a bit...
http://64.246.44.70/~lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=68201)
lemme know
That actually might be a cool addition to a co-op map(if what I'm proposing is possible). Someone in the modeling forum is building a low poly battle droid, planning to use an arena type level(maybe this one) to pit 3-8 jedi against hoards of droids. Maybe after death the jedi could respawn in groups after so many seconds in a LAAT and be delivered back to the arena. That would make quite the awsome level.
[edit]Or, even better(but more difficult), after killing the alotted number of enemies(and completing the level), the level could end with a couple of LAATs flying in, raking down the remaining droids, and delivering the remaining jedi to safety.[edit]
I agree, scripted sweetness
Winner_rex,
Neat idea! I just visited your thread, and you're doing a nice job. However, the LAAT does need a little bit more realistic detail. The pictures that were supplied by the person who replied to you should help you out greatly! Goodness, that scene went by too quickly in the movie for me to see all the complexities of those awesome ships! And look a the mini Star Destroyers in the background! Wow!
To the community, hey, if anyone wants to build some static prefabs like winner suggested, go ahead. Not sure exactly where I'll put them in the map, but it would be cool to have some direlict droid walkers and what not. I wonder if it is possible to put some working gun turrets (that you can sit in and activate) into a MP map, too?
One big question I have for all of you is how do I get a sky texture to emit light? And is the sky box supposed to cause a leak during the compile process? (Seems to load fine into JKII) I am underway here. But what I have to show right now would make you wonder how old or how sane I really am (LOL), so I'll just wait until I have something a little more substantial. I had a funny experience, though. For the temporary ground texture, I used Yavin's slip dirt. Never use this! Use Yavin gravel instead. Slip dirt is called slip dirt because it...well...makes you slip! When I tested the map, Kyle was sliding around like he was on ice skates, overly defying the rules of friction. It was hilarious! Oh well...back to designing!
Dang!
I am so looking forward to this map!!!
It is probably one of the most wanted maps IMO...
And the whole idea with battledroids and stuff.....
Just hope there will come a propper mod for co-op.....
What about....bot support?? This IS a plan in the project i guess?
(stupid question maybe)
Bot support is my intent. (I actually prefer loading it into SP and spawning a bunch of Reborn bosses...hehe...development is so much fun!..., but my goal for this level really is to make a nice MP experience.)
I'm learning as I go. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I have yet to fully understand the skybox. Also, the BIG room on the ground level of the arena, the one surrounded by two domed rock formations... is that the room Anakin and Padme were brought out of, or the room that held the arena beasts? Anyone have any pictures of this room?
Just hope you end up having a map that really makes one feel, that it is a huge arena, and such...just as in the movie...! :D
Awsome job! Keep it going, this map will be so much fun. Sorry I can't help to much, but if you somehow lack beta testers (which I doubt) I could help out in that arena.
Sithcloak
he he. . .arena. . .get it? help out. . .arena. . .oh never mind.
Dajo Before you add guns and stuff could I use your map in a sp mod. I already have most of the new npc jedi ready. I am pretty good, but not good enough to create a map of that quality. As always I will give you full credit as the author, in fact I will say you are the author of the sp level version. I was going to use all the new models coming out. Currently I have most of the jedi seen in the battle npced, and I know how to get them in maps. So if you could I would greatly apreciate it. I am quite good at designing large scale battles. I can also script pretty good. So if you would because I would love to make it for you.