Originally posted by Lord Tnuc
I trust her sounds and whatnot will be taken from the Bounty Hunter game? And the rifle sounds will be taken from the Episode II single shot? I'm very into this rifle idea...good going with the reticle. Perhaps somehow, someone could make a reticle that could lock on, like the rocket..but also act differently...like..there's a large reticle when you have the rifle...a reticle in the middle..and a circle that is around the middle reticle. perhaps, someone could make it so that the circle leaves the reticle once someone has entered the larger reticle..making it so that they're more noticeable...more of a cool feature than anything, probably.
Hey you just keep the ideas a rolling. I hadnt even considered the rifle till you suggested it! I may even do a pistol. I now got a contact who is helping me on weapons. Ill post more as it become available. Mars out!
Thanks to everyone for showing interest in the model. Heres what ive done so far...
1) refined the head model
2) finished the helmet
3) attached the helmet
4) finished the target reticule
5) sent Zam's rifle to "Locutus", in turn I should get the rifle skin out quickely.
6) started the body.
I want to take a moment and thank "Locutus" for helping me on the rifle, He is the one responsible for "Jangos" Westar pistol.
Ive been thinking about a pre release on Zam's rifle; however, it will be included with the Zam model on release. :D
Thanks again, Mars out!
Oh one more thing, stay tuned... screenshots will be coming soon!
Way to go, Marz. I hope you'll have the sound effects and the correct weapon effects (the red bolts) with the rifle.
*****screenshot is up****
www.talocan.net/mars/zamcollauge.jpg)
courtesy of KSK H2o Mars out!:D
looks good, I would smooth down the cheek bones a little, and then work on the eyes and nose shape.
I'm not sure but I think it could be related to open edges. an STL check should show if the nose and chin is attached properly.
Originally posted by Jolts
looks good, I would smooth down the cheek bones a little, and then work on the eyes and nose shape.
Yeah I agree, Im really worried about polygon count, I used a lot on the helmet, head, and now the body. I'm trying to keep it down, but I dont want to lose too many details. I actually modeled the hoses on the torso, and the crescent buckle. My concern here is that when it gets animated, are those things gonna twist and look funny?
Another point with the nose, nothing is attached (like the nose), should it be? Everything at this point is one modeled shape. Does the nose or any protrusions have an effect on UVmapping, And whats with the overlap warnings when doing the map? Is that from the nose? I guess Im a little nervous about getting in all that detail and finding out that it was modeled wrong (as far as rigging/skinning details go). What kind of things should I be concerned about when making the model? Are there things that im doing that may make the job harder down the road?
Mars out!
Originally posted by ksk h2o
I'm not sure but I think it could be related to open edges. an STL check should show if the nose and chin is attached properly.
Whats STL check? Is that an option in 3Dstudio max?
Keeping the nose attached to the head is the way I would do it, I noticed the raven models don't, they might have done it that way for ease of recyling and uvmapping. If you model everything as one piece you can always segment it later w/o any troubles.
I would keep the rest of the head as one piece. If its easier to model everything in patches do it that way, then later merge it all together. Personally I do it all as one. For the helmet maybe model it in 3 different lods do a quick texture test and see what works best.
Things like hoses you can model real cheap with a cube or triangle since its so small from a normal distance it would read fine.
Keep your surface topology as clean as possible and make sure you have enough rows around the joints for better deformation, reference the raven model for examples. It might also be easier to start modelling in quads, and then after everything is modelled go in and triangulate it.
experiment, look at other models surface topology, pm me or post a wire frame shot so I can see better what you got going
Originally posted by NeoMarz1
Whats STL check? Is that an option in 3Dstudio max?
It goes in the modifier stack. Click the scroll down list in the modifier options in the edit/modify tab and you should see a modifier called STL check somewhere in there.
Although an STL check is essentially for other purposes, it will be helpful in showing you open edges, double faces and essentially double vertices. These occur as you mirror your mesh or copy/clone parts of it as you edit the mesh. An open edge might also not animate properly or be visible in the in-game model. Double vertices are my personal hates since they seriously mess me up during weighing. They are found usually on both ends of an open-edge that was supposed to be closed. If you slect these vertices by dragging a selection box around them, you will see one vertice selected on screen, but it will say 2 vertices selected in the menu on the left. These vertices occupy the same point, but join to different edges. In most cases (not all) the open edge is supposed to be closed and these vertices which are located in the same spot are supposed to be only one. just collapse these vertices to fix this and open edges. They cause many problems when you try to weigh your mesh as you may weigh one of these verts but not the other, and although it may LOOK like your mesh is weighed and there are no unweighed vertices, carcass will tell you there is a certain vert thats left out... good luck finding this vert when its buried underneath a properly weighed vert. >.<
STL errors also come into play during smoothing. If two surfaces that are next to each other are not attached to each other (seperated by an open edge) the max smoothing will not work very well and/or the shading difference of the two surfaces will be drastic. Although this is a moot point since assimilate will do it's own smoothing regardless of what you do to your mesh in max (If you import the XSI you will see that they are devoid of smoothing), but I like to have max smooth my model properly for good renders and also to be able to view it properly and make valid editing decisions. :)
Thanks H2o and Jolts! You guys cleared a lot up for me. I have one more question, (sort of embarrased), but when you talk about "weighted"... what does that mean? You have to understand that I'm basically a newbie. I have my ideas of what that means, but maybe you can clarify :D
I appreciate the detailed info! Sincerely Mars
weighing comes into play later on in the modelling process. If you take a look at spacemonkeys tutorial you will see a section on weighing. It is what needs to be done for the model to animate properly in game. You don't need to worry about it much untill your model is basically complete anyway. But it's important that you build your model close and tightly around to the raven skeleton bc that is what you will "weigh" your mesh to, when modelling is done. :)
Well the project is moving along. I must say that im about to pull my own hair out. I am happy to report that I have made some great changes to both the helmet and face. The goggles were way off on the last screenies. It's hard to get any detail shots of em, but I think im close enough (unless someone has good pics of the goggles). I changed the brim of the helmet to look more sweeping. Only thing slowing me down is that I dont have the skelaton available. Psyko is sending I hope. Im a little reluctant to do more modeling without that, Also, if anyone has the "space monkey tutorial" (not the appendum) please send it :D
I dont want to disappoint anyone who is following this thread, so I'm doing my best!
P.S. It looks as though the rifle is moving along as well, I just got the maps, I may start skinning that even though I don't have the glm/pk3 yet. Mars out!
Originally posted by NeoMarz1
P.S. It looks as though the rifle is moving along as well, I just got the maps, I may start skinning that even though I don't have the glm/pk3 yet. Mars out!
I am very much in love with this rifle idea. Did you get the sound effects from the movie or are you just doing the visuals?
Mars, if you look into the modelling forum, I think it got renamed and joined into one HUUUGE general editing forum now. There is a thread I recently bumped up that has the title:
for anyone that needs a weighted skeleton
Inside you will find that somebody had put up a skeleton with all the tags weighed allready.... a great thing for starters. :)
I've just sent the skeleton and spacemonkey's tutorial to u marz, hope it wont jam your mail box.
I got some Great news!!!!!!!!:D
The Zam Rifle is now completed, Thanks to Locutus! He has been very very helpful, and we both have been punching away at this thing. I am going to go ahead and put out version 1 (version 2 will come out with the zam model).
Version 1 has the reticule and gun model with completed skins.
Version 2 will have sounds and edited fire blast.
I plan to send the pk3 out tommarow, so keep checking
www.JediKnight2Files.com)
I have played around with the rifle and its way cool, much better than the disruptor (in my own opinion:D ). Only bad thing is that the rifle clips the player's elbow just a tad (to be expected with the long rifle design). :mob: Mars out!
The Zam Rifle is now completed
Great job, Neo. I, for one, will be downloading both of the versions...and I can't wait for the second version..and especially for Zam herself.
Many thanks to Locutus, also, for the help he gave Neo.
:D Just sent the Rifle out! :D
Originally posted by NeoMarz1
:D Just sent the Rifle out! :D
To where?
Edit:just saw your other post! I'll keep checkin
www.jk2files.com) (
http://www.jk2files.com)
I'm curious if it will also be sent to
www.JkII.net)
Good job man. I'm lookin out for the rifle and will definately get zam herself. keep up the good work ;)
Originally posted by Lord Tnuc
I'm curious if it will also be sent to
www.JkII.net)
Yup! It was... Although, I'm not sure if it will make it to the posting there. They can be slow sometimes. Mars out!
:D****Good news****:D
More pictures posted by H20, I'm sure you will all get a kick out of what's been done so far! I'm basically working the forms, nothings been attached to the skelaton. I am considering a Zam varient with the veil covering! Possibly Zam's airspeeder for map constructions. We'll see... Mars out!
www.talocan.net/mars/zam_riflescrn2.jpg)
www.talocan.net/mars/zamtorsoshot2.jpg)
www.talocan.net/mars/zamtorsoshot3.jpg)
www.talocan.net/mars/zamtorsoshot4.jpg)
oh my god! Mars you made THAT!? all by yourself? my freaking god your just of good a modeller as you are a skinner! :D thats amazing for a guy that hasent realy done modelling before!
coming along very nicely....
:D *********EVEN BETTER NEWS***********:D
I just finished the Zam model, Don't get too excited though... It's just the model! Now comes the hard part... getting it on the skelaton, and in the game. This may actually take longer than the modeling process (for me). Its going to be a rough road from here on out! I know you guys will help me (you know who you are). I am excited, and can't wait to get Zam finished. A little early to say this but... Adi Gallia is my next one;) Mars out!
Originally posted by NeoMarz1
:D *********EVEN BETTER NEWS***********:D
I just finished the Zam model, Don't get too excited though... It's just the model! Now comes the hard part... getting it on the skelaton, and in the game. This may actually take longer than the modeling process (for me). Its going to be a rough road from here on out! I know you guys will help me (you know who you are). I am excited, and can't wait to get Zam finished. A little early to say this but... Adi Gallia is my next one;) Mars out!
That's awesome! But now for some bad news. Jk2files is down for some reason! O well, guess we'll just have to wait *curses*.
Well, Mister Marz could always ask someone with some space to spare until tomorrow to host the rifle for him so that people can actually get it.
Damn, still no rifle from either
www.jkii.net) or
www.jk2files.com)
Perhaps someone could host this themselves?
can't see the shots... :(
Originally posted by boinga1
can't see the shots... :(
Sorry forgot the .jpg attachments, Try em again, I fixed the link!
*******Also*******
I Just sent the Zam rifle out again to both Jk sites, They should show up... I hope... If someone want to host the pk3 for download, let me know and I'll send it your way. Mars out!
wow sweet! the links work now, its looking very very very nice, im lovin it,can we get some smouth shaded pics of her?... um thats great, that the model is done, i assume your going to do the skinning work yourself too, am i correct?
Originally posted by SupremePain
same here... um thats great, that the model is done, i assume your going to do the skinning work yourself too, am i correct?
Yep... of course ;). After first release, should anyone want to do a varient of some sort, just let me know. Mars out!
Smooth shaded pics? Sure, but Ive been slamming our good friend "KsK H2o" with screen shots. I'll do that a little later. Mars out yet again!
Sweet!, cant wait to see the final product!
Originally posted by Psyk0Sith
Sweet!, cant wait to see the final product!
:D Me Too :D lol
Nice marz, but isn't that a little *ahem* BLOCKY! also her boobs kind of are sagging
well dont think a thing like boobs goes un-attended! They arent sagging, they are restricted by the chest plate (almost pushed in). They in (most photos) are positioned just slightely below the shoulder frame. The idea in tho movie was to confuse the viewer into wondering if Zam was a male or female assassin. I will consider your comment, and give it a second look:D I may have positioned it too low.
Why its blocky? Well the game will smooth out the polys (to my knowledge), Right guys? It can be smoothed out in the program, but I just put out the rough screens. Thanks for your comments, Mars out.
The game will do it's own smooth shading (You'll have to put it into the .car file as a command but thats one of the last steps of modelling...) If you want to have an idea how the smoothing is going to look, you can allways smooth objects in max. But you're right, carcass will smooth the xsi all by itself. :D
Very nice models Mars. you're working very fast and very well
Yes carcass will smooth your model but i suggest u to see how your model looks when it's smooth in max because sometimes the smooth is not very good and it's look "bizarre" in the game
And in max you can correct it on moving some points
If you want help for weighting the points i can help you
Just a question how many polygons do you have ? If you haven't too much poly i think you can smooth some area on adding poly
(the back torso under the neck, the veil and maybe add details on her belt) but if not that's looks very good. More polygons you have on the articulations better will be the deformations.
In the model i specially love the head and the helmet they are really realistic.
Oh another point i think that the hand are a little "bizarre" i think that they are too flat maybe make them more curve and i don't know how to say that in english but the little finger is maybe too big and the finger too draw aside. and maybe they are too big
Or make like me use the raven hands they are perfect and i have never success in moddeling hand
Another question do you plan to make a clawdite version?
Hope my criticism are not too strong and that they help you
Just a thought, don't forget to add some lights to the scene.
I've had problems with Ki Adi, things looked fine until i sent him in-game...some weird shadows were "rendered", i had to tweak the meshes to fix the problems.
Since then i'm adding a few omni lights with shadows when modelling, it helps to see flaws and gives a better feel of the surface.
Psyk0Sith, you have a site, could you possibly do the hosting for the Zam Wessel Rifle? I'm sure Marz won't mind letting you host it since the delay with the sites.
Originally posted by Lord Tnuc
Psyk0Sith, you have a site, could you possibly do the hosting for the Zam Wessel Rifle? I'm sure Marz won't mind letting you host it since the delay with the sites.
Sure, i dunno how much bandwith i'm allowed, but i'll link it to my mirror site too.
Send it my way Marz, or anyone else who has it.
psykopat@geocities.com
Thanks for the interest in the rifle. Those guys at JK2files & JediKnight2 must be busy. I hate it cuz I see new posts all the time. Sometimes I wonder if they just dont like weapon models, but then again... They havent posted every skin I've sent in, so who knows.
So how can you get it? well Ive sent it to our good friend Psyko, maybe he can get it up for download. Mars out!
Oh! One more thing... Once you guys get the rifle, let me know what you think. There will be a version 2, so think of this as beta testing.;)
Originally posted by moooa
Very nice models Mars. you're working very fast and very well
Yes carcass will smooth your model but i suggest u to see how your model looks when it's smooth in max because sometimes the smooth is not very good and it's look "bizarre" in the game
And in max you can correct it on moving some points
If you want help for weighting the points i can help you
Just a question how many polygons do you have ? If you haven't too much poly i think you can smooth some area on adding poly
(the back torso under the neck, the veil and maybe add details on her belt) but if not that's looks very good.
Oh another point i think that the hand are a little "bizarre" i think that they are too flat maybe make them more curve.
Another question do you plan to make a clawdite version?
Hope my criticism are not too strong and that they help you
Your criticisms are greatly appreciated! They are dead on, so I take no offense. I agree with all your points, and I like what I saw of your Zam. I know we have dealt with the same character, and respect your thoughts.
Yes, I would like to add polys, How can I get a count in 3Dmax?
Im only allowed so many for the head, torso, and other parts right? Ive been really carefull about using too many (maybe too carefull?)
I may need your help, I'll let you know this weekend, or next week. I know the hands look funny right now. I more or less just slapped em on. They are going to get more work. I think its important, because they are tough, and I want to do everything from scratch. It's important to me to learn this modeling thing, it's something that ive always wanted to do. Damn its tough!
Also (and anyone can answer this), I ended up with "doubled edges" all over the helmet. How can I get rid of these without deleting polys? I messed it up somehow. Is it really a big concern?
Mars out!
Originally posted by Psyk0Sith
Just a thought, don't forget to add some lights to the scene.
I've had problems with Ki Adi, things looked fine until i sent him in-game...some weird shadows were "rendered", i had to tweak the meshes to fix the problems.
Since then i'm adding a few omni lights with shadows when modelling, it helps to see flaws and gives a better feel of the surface.
Thats a great suggestion. I'ma gonna do that! Hey by the way, thanks for putting my Ki Adi skin as one of your links, way cool! Now everyone one will know my name Wooohahahahaha! Sorry my ego got out again;) Mars out!
marz, everyone already knows your name...see the pics now, look good. Could we see her in another position sometime, like doing something?
along with the hands I would work on the shoulders and forarms also. The neck leading into the shoulders could be tinkered with, sometimes I model part of the body under the clothing then delete out what won't be seen later. Here's a ref pic you might wanna check out
http://www.fineart.sk/page027.gif)
Originally posted by Jolts
along with the hands I would work on the shoulders and forarms also. The neck leading into the shoulders could be tinkered with, sometimes I model part of the body under the clothing then delete out what won't be seen later. Here's a ref pic you might wanna check out
http://www.fineart.sk/page027.gif)
I guess the problem I'm having now is aligning The parts to the skeleton and keeping proportions right. The neck is almost too long, simply cuz I'm trying to center the head mass with the bone. how close do they need to be? I'm curious how Psyko handled this with his Yarael poof model (with long neck). The skeleton should be pretty straight forward (one would think), but the raven frame seems a bit odd. This may sound dumb cuz I'm just getting into the skeleton, but what's with the burst of bones coming out of the front of the skull section?(if they are bones) Mars out!
Someone...get...this..rifle...hosted :crybaby:
Alright i got the rifle up on my site, sorry i didnt check my e-mails, i was busy fixing Ponda Baba...argh.
****Download Zam's rifle by Marz!!!!*** (
http://www3.sympatico.ca/psykopat/downloads/zam_rifle_v1.zip)
...This may sound dumb cuz I'm just getting into the skeleton, but what's with the burst of bones coming out of the front of the skull section?...
i think you mean the facial bones? hehe yeah that looks scary but its pretty easy to weight, just dont start there.
i usually start with the feet and end with da fingers (the worst part).
You dont have to follow the skeleton 100% to deform the mesh correctly, just as long as you follow the structure you should be alright.
Yarael's neck uses 1 bone for the head movement, so i applied 100% influence on the skull and part of the neck, the other half (down) got 50%. Dunno if that makes any sense to you.
Good luck with the weighting marathon! :D