Aha, I can spot a fellow director wannabe when I see one IdontlikeGeorge :)

I agree with you wholeheartedly, I enjoyed the long intro in Lasse's bit, your suggestions for the camerawork are interesting. Lassev's style is more for static cams and zooms, I tend to go for a lot more camera movement and pans - personal preference is all I think. I also agree that his part was the better overall, he did a great job!

Lassev and me have talked it over and basically Lassev doesn't have the time for a part 2 with work commitments plus other projects, but maybe one day he will co-produce another part with me :) I can probabaly do part 2 on my own, but I will be looking for people to co-create some of the other (more tricky) parts.

It may have taken you a day to get that girl dancing properly, but at least you managed proper dancing! Luckily, Ander's dancing at the beginning is kind of supposed to be utterly rediculous....still....it is pretty terrible!

Anyway, as much as I am pleased with Part 1 I can see lots of room for improvement in terms of pacing and structure of the scripts, and especially in my own scripting and level construction. I really think there is a lot of potential here!

Wedge, we will have to get you in every time somewhere eh? ;)

Originally posted by Kengo

Wedge, we will have to get you in every time somewhere eh? ;)

Wow, Kengo, that is a crystallization of a magnificent idea! Don't let go of it. It will turn out to be a be a masterful joke that will run the lenght of the entire saga. Slowly people will realise that Wedge is always there, with dozens of different roles, sometimes nothing more than a voice in a radio.

Truely he is the Alec Guinness of our generation!

OK, some hints on part 2..... The team go to Ord Mantell, I'm still looking at exactly what that place looks like (pics always gladly recieved). There is also a lot of talking onboard their ship, the Century Fox, where we learn a lot more about Car'Let's training at the Jedi Academy (lets just say things have gotten a little easier since Obi Wan's day). Interesting to see he's currently narrowly ahead on the favourite characters poll, for me he has emerged as perhaps the main character in a way (as close to one as we have anyway). I really love what Matthew Pate did with his voice there, especially impressive if you know of his Antipidian background :)

Did anyone notice Chewie wander past at Bridge Street? I will throw in another such Star Wars cameo in part 2, no prizes for guessing who on the dangerous trading World of Ord Mantell...

Been getting a lot of input on scripts - Ewok Mercenary sent me a really cool plot idea which I am definately going to use, in a slightly adapted form. My co-writter, Niall Henderson, is working on jokes for Parts 2 and 3 at the moment :)

Originally posted by Casper
And did I say anything negative towards you the whole time. Today. Did I? And If you wan't to mess with me do it over msn.
Well?

Originally posted by lassev
This was an example of a compromise between time and quality. That's what I'm always saying (and I'm also saying that only Eldritch can have both: a short time and a high quality...).
Flattery will get you nowhere. ;)

"This was an example of a compromise between time and quality."

All you had to say. I felt your previous paragraph were poor excuses! :p But this line speaks truth.

Still, I will defend my camera suggestions, by noting, on the contrary to your argument about having a lack of set - I have to disagree.

For one, I never asked for some regional panoramic view of the city. I just feel some extra camera movement would really pay off for that scene.

A more specific suggestion: the camera position above the walk, where you can see the floating swoop bikes on the side near the CorSec building. How about, move and pan the camera from there, to a position on the opposite side of the street, viewing the CorSec building?

This camera would also view Carlet walking, as well. And you would only need 1 extra ref_tag and info_null, and 2 more lines in a script. But it would add more variety.


Watching the whole thing through, with extra scrutiny this time around, I think the main thing I dislike is the lack of transition in the movie. One thing I think would improve on that, is using camera fades:


//Generated by BehavEd

rem ( "fade out" );
camera ( FADE, < 0 0 0 >, 0, < 0 0 0 >, 1, 2000 );
rem ( "fade in" );
camera ( FADE, < 0 0 0 >, 1, < 0 0 0 >, 0, 2000 );

Would be good for ending and opening the maps, and would be good for scene changes in the same map - like between the reception lobby, and the hall to the chief's office; and between the three stooges being lost in the city, to actually arriving at the meeting point. (I find it funny how Castle was bitching at the three grunts for being late, when Makso and Mr. Black haven't even shown up! :p )

Ok, I'm done right now. :)

Would've been fun to have the camera start somewhere in a CorSec office on a higher level, then move through an open window to show Carlet coming.

Originally posted by Eldritch
Flattery will get you nowhere. ;)

The best thing is that I can do it as much as I want, because I'm not even trying to get anywhere!

Originally posted by idontlikegeorge
All you had to say. I felt your previous paragraph were poor excuses! But this line speaks truth.

Still, I will defend my camera suggestions, by noting, on the contrary to your argument about having a lack of set - I have to disagree.

For one, I never asked for some regional panoramic view of the city. I just feel some extra camera movement would really pay off for that scene.

Well, they were partly excuses, I confess, but there was more truth to them than you can possibly know, because you cannot see the map otherwise than through the fixed camera views.

Still, I admit I could have done better camera work. I realised that also when I watched Kengo's parts of the movie (although they had far too few cameras even if the dynamic aspects were often better than mine).

Yeah, but this is one thing I'm going to mess with and study in a little project I'm doing right now. I really have to get used to moving cameras (probably with path_corners if they grant smooth movement. Ref_taqs produce those nasty linear paths with sharp turns. And I don't expect to be able to use roffs...).

What can I say? I'm no master but I'm trying to learn...

One tricky thing with say the Bridge-Street bit was that its a very, very long scene with lots of dialogue. I think far longer than you'll usually see a dialogue scene in one place in a film - so I kinda of ran out camera angles and ended repeating them a lot. If you look at a sitcom like Friends or Frasier, they tend to have longer dialogue scenes from time to time and sometimes a fixed cam that just panning a little is good enough. It really depends on the situation. Personally, I still think the hardest thing to do is combine camerawork with lots of action!

I'm pretty sure Lasse's bit has fades or black outs between scenes - I left mine without just because I like that instant transition feel sometimes. I'm sure to try it at times on later partd though.

All these ideas for shots and possible improvements for latter parts can only be good, I am really looking forward to trying some of them out :)

Ewok Mercenary sent me a really cool plot idea which I am definately going to use, in a slightly adapted form.

It's Ewok Mercenary For Hire! I just wasn't able to fit the whole thing on here... :p

I'm glad that you like it Si, I could easily come up with a lot more if you like :)

You may be for hire, but I want to assure you that you will NOT be getting paid for cool ideas :D

I will have to talk to you about some more plot ideas then, and more jokes in the scripts are never a bad thing.

What? No pay? You ungrateful sod... ;)

If you wanna talk to me I'm on MSN, and now that I've got broadband I'll be on it more regularly. Although saying that, I've never seen you online once...

How? Kengo never sleeps!:)

[quote]Watching the whole thing through, with extra scrutiny this time around, I think the main thing I dislike is the lack of transition in the movie. One thing I think would improve on that, is using camera fades:



code:--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
//Generated by BehavEd

rem ( "fade out" );
camera ( FADE, < 0 0 0 >, 0, < 0 0 0 >, 1, 2000 );
rem ( "fade in" );
camera ( FADE, < 0 0 0 >, 1, < 0 0 0 >, 0, 2000 );--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[quote]

Yeah, camera fades always look nice, I think you can change the color of the fade also... i dont know why you would want too, but still. :)

Color is no problem to make with fades (look at the < 0 0 0 > parts), but if anything, I suggest sticking to black... And maybe purple:p... But for now let's just say black...
I don't think there were any fades needed in the movie! Maybe fade-ins at the beginning of each new scene (a scene being a level in this case), and fade-outs at the end of each scene! Other than that, it was perfectly fine to me!:)

Ha! You infidels of little faith! I checked it just for your pleasure, and indeed I have fades in every place I thought a fade would be in order!

1) I have a fade in in the beginning.

2) I have a fade in the chronological transition when Jaden teleports from the lobby to the corridor.

3) I have a fade out in the end.

Those were the spots I think were justified. The only other occasion might have been when I changed the camera from pointing to Jaden climbing the stairs to Wedge... er... Receptionist and Castle. But that was not a chronological transition, so I thought not to use it there.

EDIT: Well, I admit that a working fade out in the end is only in version 1.10, if you think I'm unjustified in my accusations...

Ok, I did notice the fade in... although it was very faint. Should raise the last float variable (time in m/s).

Yeah, and I did notice that there was a fade between the receptionist and the hallway. I didn't remember last time, because I didn't think of fades until the break between the chief's office, and all of the Bridge street scene.

Yeah, and looking at the cormaster script, I do see the ending fade out... except in the version I have, the variables are the wrong way (so it's set to fade in, instead of out).


I was wondering, could I tweek with some of the script files you guys made, to see if I can try any tricks?

Of course I wouldn't release anything, or even ask any of you to do any successful changes... just a learning experience type of thing. :)

We'll have to see what Lasse says for his bits of script. For my (rather less advanced) scripts, you can most certainly play around with them all you want, as long as I don't see 'Corellian Squad' or somesuch cutscene film on the net :)

I'm afraid we won't actually be updating Part 1 any more, unless there turns out to be some ultra-massive fault with it. I'm a perfectionist right up to when I finish something, at which point I stop caring. With scripting like this, I'm sure there are bits that could be tweaked, but I can't see the point of releasing such minor tweaks for something of this format :)

Originally posted by idontlikegeorge
Yeah, and looking at the cormaster script, I do see the ending fade out... except in the version I have, the variables are the wrong way (so it's set to fade in, instead of out).

Well, I don't remember the first version so well, except that the level_change ended the level before the fade took action, so it's no problem, but the new one has an end fade like this, which is, of course, correct:

camera ( /*@CAMERA_COMMANDS*/ FADE, < 0.000 0.000 0.000 >, 0.000, < 0.000 0.000 0.000 >, 1.000, 2000 );


Originally posted by idontlikegeorge
I was wondering, could I tweek with some of the script files you guys made, to see if I can try any tricks?

Of course I wouldn't release anything, or even ask any of you to do any successful changes... just a learning experience type of thing.
Sure you can :). No need to even ask. As long as they stay on your HD, you can do with them what ever you desire. Examples are the best way to learn, except for examples with explanations, that is.

However, I should give you here a word of warning. Rather than use my scripts as examples, use the Raven scripts. As you have seen, there have been unforeseen problems with my scripts, and in the future I will drastically change my scripting conventions to resemble those of Raven. I can only suggest you do the same.

Originally posted by Kengo
I'm afraid we won't actually be updating Part 1 any more, unless there turns out to be some ultra-massive fault with it. I'm a perfectionist right up to when I finish something, at which point I stop caring. With scripting like this, I'm sure there are bits that could be tweaked, but I can't see the point of releasing such minor tweaks for something of this format :)

Well, the CorSec cinematic master script for version 1.10 is all screwed up. Anybody can see that the cameras point this way and that, but hardly ever to the right direction. This is originally due to an inexplicable corruption that occured while the script was being transferred from me to Kengo. Kengo tried to save the script, which unfortunately did not succeed because of my very bad camera (ref_taq) naming conventions (and who knows if the fact that there was so much Finnish in the script caused Kengo to swerve).

Sorry for the problems with v1.10, they were really of my doing, I sadly caused some errors in Lasse's script when I transfered it over. However, we got it all fixed with the definative v1.20 release of Part 1!

http://www.pcgamemods.com/3950/)

I am now looking at Part 2, which will partly be set on Ord Mantell. Any pics/data people can find me on it would be much appreciated!

A WMV version of Part 1 by Andy867 is now avaliable for all you non-JA owning people here:

http://www.pcgamemods.com/4216/)

Requires Windows Media Player to run.