Originally posted by Kurgan
I mean, which would you rather play, in all honestly, a game where you're a moisture farmer or Imperial janitor who never sees any battles or crazy things happen or one of the heroes from the movies having amazing adventures and interacting with other famous characters, doing some of the things we saw happen in the films?*
[/i] Judging from Galaxies, I fear to see how many people would choose exactly that.

I'd like to see a mixture between KOTOR and JK.
- The possibility to give your Character Attributes, like in RPG games.
- the attributes you have chosen determine what force powers you can use.
- a side program to create your own fighting stance, I already have a concept for such a program, but can't do programming
- and what I guess what most people wanna see is, either two ways to play the campaign sith or jedi, other sequences and different missions or two different campaigns.

What could possibly be the future of the JK series? Other hard core Stbbvar Wars FPS's are coming out for the gunner crowd; take a look at Republic Commando and Battlefront. KOTOR and its sequel have expanded on the route of the Jedi and Sith. Is there a need for a game that combines the gunner and saberist?

The way I see it, it has no future, with games like those coming out. Unless it uses a new engine, the jk series is done.

i would like another jk game since in the other games mentioned you can't use lightsaber like you use on jk series.

KOTOR and its sequel have expanded on the route of the Jedi and Sith

KOTOR has a MUCH better saber system, even if it is sort of atuomatic, it's MUCH better.

my hope is that as jo was to obi-wan game, jk4 is to the new episode 3 game slated for next year :D

Originally posted by Mono_Giganto
KOTOR has a MUCH better saber system, even if it is sort of atuomatic, it's MUCH better.
Dude not everybody thinks like you ;)

Well, if they're to launch another JK game, they better use a new engine. JA is good but without mods I would have left it after a few months and gone back to JO. Clans as well, that keeps the game alive (if it's Multiplayer).

I also hope they make up a good story, KOTOR's was excellent. It's so annoying with all the stupid Force boys running around thinking they're so good when you beat them all and Tavion.

Originally posted by Mono_Giganto
KOTOR has a MUCH better saber system, even if it is sort of atuomatic, it's MUCH better.

What kind of crack are you on?

kotor's saber system isn't even a saber system. all it is, is an animation with random damage multipliers and algorithms applied to it. its no different than any of the other attacks besides how it looks. and with all that, its only just a tad bit more random than baseja.

Originally posted by Mono_Giganto
KOTOR has a MUCH better saber system, even if it is sort of atuomatic, it's MUCH better. Better how? It certainly looks better for the most part, but that system would hardly be a good one in a FPS. It doesn't even have collision detection, for crying out loud.

And Rumor is right, it isn't really a saber system per se. It is a combat system. The only difference between sabers and guns are the animations and what modifiers get applied.

That being said, the KOTOR system seems to serve KOTOR better than the JA system does for JA...

At least with KOTOR it is supposed to be random. :)

That being said, the KOTOR system seems to serve KOTOR better than the JA system does for JA...

Ya, that's kinda what I meant, I wasn't saying that JA needed KOTOR's system, just that it worked better for its game.

At least with KOTOR it is supposed to be random.

Very true. :) And it also has limits to the damage. In JA there's always the random one hit kill.

If all future Jedi Knight games are doomed to degenerate the way JKII:JO and JK:JA have (a few hundred total players (compared to the thousands playing other games) flying around with jetpacks and spawning Rancors, amateur actors emoting and whining about "laming" while killtrackers spam "haha you are the 22 soul I have taken, I have stolen your soul 3 times"), then I hope LucasArts either makes the next one single-player only or never releases the source code to prevent the silliness and stupidity that killed JK2 and JA multiplayer.

Hopefully Battlefront and Republic Commando will be the future direction of Star Wars multiplayer games.

Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
I hope LucasArts either makes the next one single-player only That would be just fine with me. :)

If it is Single Player the Story will be more complex. Oh, we're talking about LucasArts Jedi Knight Games? I thought we were talking about something else. LucasArts cannot make a decent SP story (the closest was JK2)

Originally posted by Iain007
If it is Single Player the Story will be more complex. Oh, we're talking about LucasArts Jedi Knight Games? I thought we were talking about something else. LucasArts cannot make a decent SP story (the closest was JK2)

Jedi Knight seemed at least as good as Outcast to me...

I say make the next Jedi Knight unmoddable. No more crappy admin mods.

Personally, I hope we can still make new hilts and maps in the next game, but apart from that, yes, remove possibilities of the admin mods.

Originally posted by Mono_Giganto
Personally, I hope we can still make new hilts and maps in the next game, but apart from that, yes, remove possibilities of the admin mods.

Modelling, skinning, and mapping don't need the source code, so all of those could continue even if the MP source code was never released.

We can dream. :)

Although, there have been some cool MP source code mods put out, and it is too bad that they get overshadowed...

everyone "must" pay for the mistakes of some people

Have LucasArts and Raven just decided to quiet down after the relative flop of Jedi Academy?

Come on,just because it didn't turn out that well it doesn't mean that another sequel shouldn't come out...this time if they should do another one Raven should come out with a more concerted and more spirited effort that should hold the fans in for more than enough time until the next one comes out.

What do you guys think?

LucasArts isn't exactly quiet with Battlefront, Republic Commando, KOTOR II, SWG:Jump to Lightspeed, and the Episode III game in the works. And Raven is working on Quake 4.

A game that was on the best seller's list for multiple weeks is not considered a "flop".

Just a thought but if it is suck a flop why bother posting in a JA forum?

In about a month the game will celebrate it's one year anniversary.

How fast should sequels to a game be made?

This isn't "The Sims" after all...


And remember how everybody complained that JA felt "Rushed"? It came out barely a year after JK2!

Sides, people are demanding a new engine for the new game, which means even more time.

Ultimately LucasArts decides who gets to make JK4, if it gets made at all. LucasArts also has to make a profit, so that means they have priorities, not just cranking out sequels as fast as they possibly can for this series, regardless of quality.

Maybe it would have been cool if they paid Raven to continue to update and add content to JA over this past year (beyond the 1.01 patch). That would have been cool. But unless they were selling the updates to fans, they'd be losing money, so they opted not to.

JA wasn't really a flop and it'll get a boost in sales with the release of the SW DVD's and the new SW movie to be sure. Will there be a JK4 by that time? I doubt it. Raven is busy with other games (that doesn't mean they can't start another project, but I don't work for them so you'd have to ask them) and LucasArts is already planning a new "Jedi" game (though it's not part of the JK series, and we really have no idea how it plays or what platforms its going to be on yet) based on Episode III.

but I don't work for them so you'd have to ask them

Even if someone did ask, they probably won't answere. We won't know about a sequel until LucasArts says "Here it is!"

I wish, even if they were only in the planning stage, that they would at least say "Yeah, we are making a new JK game, just relax because it won't be done for a while!" or something.

It would be cool if they made an expansion. I would be happy with a bunch of new models and maps :D Maybe a cool ladder for SP, and they could tie up all the loose ends in MP. (If you look in the pk3s there appears to be files that aren't even used, which tells me they didn't finish 100%)

Have LucasArts and Raven just decided to quiet down
About this,I meant,quiet down about the development for Jedi Knight 4.Sorry for the misunderstandings.

A game that was on the best seller's list for multiple weeks is not considered a "flop".
And remember how everybody complained that JA felt "Rushed"? It came out barely a year after JK2!
Now again,what I mean by "flop" is about the quality of the gameplay.Yes,though it is 5 million times better than JO,but the storyline was imho,very separated and the main theme(New Reborns and Cult stories) were not very developed as the main theme in JO was.

Just a thought but if it is suck a flop why bother posting in a JA forum?
I loved every bit of JA,nonetheless.

In about a month the game will celebrate it's one year anniversary.
How fast should sequels to a game be made?
At least LA/LEC/Raven should inform us,if they have any,about plans for an upcoming JK4...that'll keep us happy for the subsequent number of years they decide to take to make the next award-winning Jedi Knight game.

"Yeah, we are making a new JK game, just relax because it won't be done for a while!"
My kind of idea.;)

...and they could tie up all the loose ends in MP.
I rather that they tie up some of the loose ends in SP.

Generally,it is quite interesting to see the Jedi Knight to fight different enemies as in JA but it would be also good if Raven could make the storyline in such a way that each mission had its significance in the main cause that is to destroy this new Cult of Ragnos...at least one idea is like,to show a different cutscene roughly depending on the sequence of which you complete the tiered missions.

JA =5 million times better?

No.

If so, why would people, after buying JA, abandon it, and go back to JO? Why are there still so many people on JO servers? The answer is: JA sucks.

Originally posted by Druid Bremen
JA =5 million times better?


Did you believe that?It was just a simple exaggeration. Nevertheless,imho JA was better than JO in terms of gameplay,gameplay,that's all.

Originally posted by Druid Bremen
The answer is: JA sucks
That is why we need to redeem ourselves with a new,award-winning game.But we shall need Raven in full force though.

Originally posted by Toa Tahu
Have LucasArts and Raven just decided to quiet down after the relative flop of Jedi Academy?

Come on,just because it didn't turn out that well it doesn't mean that another sequel shouldn't come out...this time if they should do another one Raven should come out with a more concerted and more spirited effort that should hold the fans in for more than enough time until the next one comes out.

What do you guys think?

You think it sucks :P But others don't :P

Actually the differences between the games were extremely minor, so minor in fact you'd never notice them unless you were a hardcore "saber only" player.

JA is JK2 with some graphical/gameplay tweaks and a couple of new weapons added. Otherwise they play very very similarly. Hence the similar communities.

Though on the other hand, JA has many features that JK2 lacks, such as the use of more force powers in SP mode, the whole "customize your character" thing in SP, in MP you have the vehicles, npc's and upped limits on objects plus Siege mode which is by far a greatly expanded version of what SAGA & Jedi vs. Merc were in JK2.

While the out-of-box bot support in JA was very sub par, in every other way I think JA meets or exceeds the standards set by JK2. Things like the quality of the SP experience and the "cinematic feel/skill" of the saber duels are more subjective things.

Hence, the complaint by many folks that to them "JA is just an expansion pack, not a true sequel!"

While some of those folks I think need to relax (they're really demanding a whole new engine with revolutionary graphics upgrades), some of them do have a point. The game feels a bit rushed in places, like Siege could have been expanded even more from what we got (heck, it took them working on their own for several months to get Destroyer/Asteroids released, and that was them working for free). Given more time JA could have been a much more polished game, but it still would have angered some saber-only purists who didn't want anything changed from the "perfect" (in their view) JK2 model (either 1.02 or 1.04 depending on whom you ask) and still would not have impressed the people wishing for Doom3 quality graphics (I assume of course they didn't want the game to be as dark as Doom3 where you need a flashlight to see anything, heh).

Anyway, if they do make another JK game, I agree, I hope it's light years beyond JK2/JA, and I hope it lives up to all our expectations. But it's almost like a new Star Wars film... our hopes are so high, is it even possible to meet those expectations? Something to ponder...

Originally posted by Kurgan
Actually the differences between the games were extremely minor, so minor in fact you'd never notice them unless you were a hardcore "saber only" player.



i dunno, the gunning aspect of it seems pretty different too. not an entire overhaul of course, but there are some differences mainly being the hitboxes are smaller, annoying descope delay and a less accurate golan.

You think it sucks :P But others don't :P
I do?

Nice post,Kurgan.I agree with you about your post about why people refer to JA as an impure sequel.Actually,IMHO,though a sequel needs not to be *completely* new,the devs should make something that is significantly,or distinctly new,or else they won't be able to attract other non-fan gamers.

Siege was wasted in a way,due to the absence of bots...if third-party devs(in simple words:modders:D) are able to produce some simple bots for Siege I don't see why didn't Raven give us some bots for Siege.

Also,yes,JA feels really rushed.Raven should have given themselves much,much more time to develop JA...like Kurgan said,given more time JA could(should) be more polished,and would be a much,much better game.

Graphics is not a problem for me.(after all,I've only got a GF2MX.:D)

But hit detection needs to be polished,really.I remember this part in JA,where I was playing MP with the bots.I used the heavy single style,and I was slashing downwards when I moved my crosshair to face Tavion(it also happened to Desann,once) mid-way through the slash.And I killed Tavion(and Desann).

I remember seeing Lightsabers able to sever limbs and kill with one blow.What do you think about bosses in JA that couldn't be killed with one shot?

Originally posted by Toa Tahu
I remember seeing Lightsabers able to sever limbs and kill with one blow.What do you think about bosses in JA that couldn't be killed with one shot? that's a factor of the game itself, no game is gonna be super realistic in health issues. It's no fun just running around you hit a guy he's dead, well it is for a little bit, but then it gets boring, there is no challenge. In shooter games you have similiar problems with headshots and torso shots, they have semi-superhuman health so that it's more of a challenge to kill someone instead of one shot one kill.

What Lucasarts needs to do is make a Jedi Knight video game based off a new Jedi but base it in the prequel trilogy era maybe between episode III and episode IV? Tie it to the first Dark Forces so it is a prequel also.

I think there will come a new one

Originally posted by Amidala from Chop Shop
If all future Jedi Knight games are doomed to degenerate the way JKII:JO and JK:JA have (a few hundred total players (compared to the thousands playing other games) flying around with jetpacks and spawning Rancors, amateur actors emoting and whining about "laming" while killtrackers spam "haha you are the 22 soul I have taken, I have stolen your soul 3 times"), then I hope LucasArts either makes the next one single-player only or never releases the source code to prevent the silliness and stupidity that killed JK2 and JA multiplayer.

Hopefully Battlefront and Republic Commando will be the future direction of Star Wars multiplayer games.


I remember you sticking up for JK:A after release, as well as 'Master William'.

"This game will be great!1"
"Give it a few months and the holidays and there will be thousands of players".

But I agree with what you've said today.


The fact is, raven have really plumetted in terms of 'good games'.
Perhaps to draw a parallel, Elite Force was perhaps the first (and only) 'great' Star Trek game. A few years later, Elite Force 2 was released with what looked like quake 3 weapons with 'sci-fi' names and ludicrous multiplayer (ie. CTF was won on points (generated from kills), rather than captures), completely screwing the 'orthodoxy' that attracted so many fans and competetive players.

Similarly, JK2 was different. The 3rd person acrobatics, the multivarious array of combos and the strict physical rules (ie. This hit does *** damage, as well as one definitive hit box determining a hit and a miss) meant JK2 was ideal for competetive gameplay. There were no (or very few) 'variables.' Things that might have happened, things that damaged when they shouldn't or things that missed when they hit.
Then raven release JK:A. The huge maps obviously suggesting a more 'gun' orientated game.
The saber system was frankly aweful. With most of the games code copied from JK2, I'm not sure what took them so long. People claim 'you just can't adapt.' But that was never the arguement.

The arguement centered around the actual physics and hit detection being random. I'm sure if these extra 'moves' were added to jk2, players would adapt easily. It was not the extra 'moves', merely the aweful arena in which any saber combat was being undertaken.

This suggests, once again that developers are focusing far more on graphics that gameplay.
I'm sure a few movie creators, RPG'ers and other fans love the superior graphics of JK:A. However, this is a FPS game, not a film set, not a play and not a film. The point is: Graphics don't make a good game, gameplay does.
I'd far sooner play a game with superb gameplay in the (comparatively) attrocious graphics of an un-modded Quake 3 engine, than to play a dissapointingly tedious game in a superbly rendered environment.

Well, Quake 4 is released soon, lets hope Raven can do a little better there, but I wouldn't hold much hope with that company.

funny thing is, in some games you don't need the source code to make mods. CoD for example, just has a lot of scripting that all of the mods out there are made with.

JK was like that also, IIRC - you could only edit the .cog scripts, I think. No source code was released, and people loved that game for 5 years. And they still love it. Hmmm...

Hi,

I have a couple of questions:

Is Jedi Academy the last of the Jedi Knight series, or is Lucasarts thinking of making a Jedi Knight 4?

and, Where can I get level creation/editing software for Jedi Academy? Can I use the same ones as for Outcast?

Thanks for any answers.

I know nothing about editing, so I'll answer your first question :)

We don't know if LA plans a sequel yet. However, since the JK games are quite popular, my guess is that LA will do a sequel. Also, many people think that the Dark Side ending of JA leaves a decent plot open for a next game.

It might take a couple of years, but I think we can definitely expect something.

I hope it takes a couple years, or it'll come out to soon and be crappy.

LC has not confirmed a Jedi Knight 4 yet. But it is possible there might be one in the coming years, but still we have no proof.

But i would love to see the Jedi Knight series being spiced up with new graphics and physics. :cool:

Originally posted by Darth54
We don't know if LA plans a sequel yet. However, since the JK games are quite popular, my guess is that LA will do a sequel. Maybe, but so was the X-Wing series, and that has been terminated...

You can download the Editing tools from LucasFiles.com (among other sites of course).

You can download the Editing tools from LucasFiles.com (among other sites of course).

After playing the faintly silly but mostly excellent "Revenge of the Sith" campaign by Blaster, I'm inspired to think that perhaps JA has a future as a game after all. What stories one can tell using the medium of JA!

I would really like a prequel back in the times of Exar Kun or something. The past is so much more interesting than just having some random sith appear and all the jedi go "OMG WE MUST DEFEAT IT!!!"

I see Jedi Academy simultaneously suggesting two paths:

- The traditional 'Big Story', with some ultimate evil dude with galactical conquest in mind.

- A version of the typical CoD/MoH type thing. Picture it, occurring ~300 - 500 years before the prequels, when there were no real sith, thousands of Jedi, relative peace, but lots of local conflict. Jedi were regularly dispatched to deal with these disputes. Therefore, you could have "Jedi Knight: Keepers of the Peace", and have a few 'missions', each with different levels, making it more detailed and in-depth at each location than was possible in JA. Perhaps you'd choose a Jedi for each mission, perhaps have your own.

Just my thoughts ...

Mike