Originally posted by Ronin_Medjai
Ok lets all do Ronin a Favor and stop bitching about "RPG Saber Noobies" cause IMO they are a disgrace to the RPG world of JKO.
Heh, sorry about that.
You are right, what they do is really in no way shape or form role playing as in what you do.
Personally from this day on for me at least, it will just be "fan boy saber noobies".
*fan boy copyrighted by Spider AL 2003
/Back on topic.
Server rules are one thing.
If a server has a rule that you must put a [GAY] tag in your name, then do it or leave.
That is no the issue.
The problem I have is with individual players who seek to "enforce" this wherever they go, even on servers that have no such rules.
Now as for the bowing.
No it is not a big deal and yes it only takes all of 1/2 a second to do it.
90% of the time I do it out of habit and don't even consciously realize I'm doing it.
My problem with the bowing are those people who do those "long drawn out 30 minute put the saber away, crouch, look down as slow as humanly possible, stay there for another 45 minutes, look up as slow as humanly possible, stand up, remain still for another 30 minutes, then walk slowly around the map for 15 minutes, then finally ignite the saber" bows.
These people are also the type who stand there like utter morons when they see you running right at them and never bother to put up any defense.
You can actually kick them 3-4 times before they turn the saber on. But instead of fighting at this point they usually stop and call you "gay".
Yesterday I had two guys say "You don't bow I refuse to fight you".
In the past I did a really fast one and they said "That's not a real bow, do it again the right way so we can begin".
I mean really, come one people Star Wars was never that damn fruity the last time I checked.
The whining people, like the guy who started this thread, don't know a thing about RP'ing. I can imagine you in a RPG. With your lols, rofls and other dumb things.
And saying bowing is RP'ing isn't true either. Someone said that you use your model to do an emote. That isn't RP'ing. You shoot people with your model too, is that RP'ing???
Sheesh ... do what you want, if someone doesn't behave on my server they get kicked.
Originally posted by shock ~ unnamed
Very effective?
Crap man, imagine as a gunner facing 4 guys who were all using OGC.
It was funny before the first round went live one of my guys goes "They are using energize this time".
I look over and I see 4 guys all with chat boxes over their heads firing off energize at like 1 millisecond per shot.
The hypocrisy of what they did pissed me off (at the time) but I still have to admire the ingenuity of it.
hehe actually i have faced the tactic before. pG uses the tactic and in my euro match against them (i play for a euro team too). they had 3 defenders all with the te script/ constant pulling/wait for rage to wear off and kill you. that's ALL they did. i have to admit, that was the most frustrating game i've ever played in my entire life. Rage didnt work, absorb didnt work, protect didnt work, going in and sniping them first didnt work, trying to rocket them first didnt work (they'd just push/energize), you'd never get far enough away to use an energy shield... yea that was the worst game i've ever played. me toosexy aeroshift jimbeam and khaza were beaten 12-0 and 8-0 and you know full well how good we are (me toosexy and aero were all voted in the top 10 gunners of jk2). it is an ingenius strat though and it's totally effecitve... it's just that it's TOO effective =(.
There seems to be some heat rising...
well if it's a duel, bowing is respectable. But if you notice the other guy doesn't feel like bowing and instead feals like cutting the BS and getting on with it, for heavens sake don't lower you light saber and say "Saber down = peace" For that, you deserve to die!
I have no prob. with RPing. But no one should have to if they don't want to. The point of the game is to kill your enemies, not to impress them by bowing fifty million times proving your more honorable. How does pushing shift mean your honorable? You wan't real honor in a game, press the URL in my sig. NOW THAT GAME HAS HONOR!!!!!!
why do you think people should have to do it your way?
(Not directed at any individual, but people in general who share the beliefe that evryone should rp, and you shouldn't be able to kill someone when they have no weapon.)
It's like playing any game and killing the wimpy little brother before he got a weapon.
You kill them when their sabers down so they don't get it up and kill you. DUH!
Me, I use tons of Thermal detanators, they do tons of damage(three hit's and your dead) and they can't be deflected. They can be force pushed, which is why I wait for an opportunity.
If you've got a problem with over use of Thermals, I hope you don't over use Lighting. Me, I don't have a problem with overusers of lighting, it's a little cheap, but I still win! And if youve got a problem with over users of Thermals, for heavens sake learn to use force push!
Originally posted by Hиkx Nтxъ:
It's a Star Wars game, not Frag Wars.
Like it or not, Hekx, it's a frag-based FPS game. Even duel servers have a scoreboard. ;) Just because the game's based around Jedi, doesn't make it an RPG. In a lot of the public duel servers I used to play on, the admins were fanboys. They'd come on to the server and kick people for killing them, and their only explanation was "He used x move too much." Too much? How much is too much? Enough to kill the fanboy, that's how much. There was no such rule on the server. Fanboys are hypocrisy made flesh.
Originally posted by Hиkx Nтxъ:
If you want to 'frag' to get a high score, stay away from RPG servers.Well I don't know about anyone else, but I've never set foot in an RPG server since JO was released. That doesn't stop the fanboys coming to OUR servers and demanding that we all roleplay though. Fanboys are a serious problem in the Dark Forces community, and they've been even more trouble since JO was released, simply because the game is dedicated-server based. But even in the days of JK1 they infected our servers. I'd sit on the zone with a game called:
"BGJ FF NH - 1on1 - No holds Barred"
And the fanboys would come in, I'd kill them once, they'd call me a lamer and leave. Even back then they were wasting everyone's time.
Originally posted by Hиkx Nтxъ:
If you don't like the game and it's rules. Go play Quake.
There are no rules, Hekx. Admins may choose to put rules down for specific servers, but the majority of public servers in my day had no such rules. These are the servers that the insipid fanboys seek to capture and rule. There's no excuse for that kind of behaviour.
Oh, and your statement is equivalent to, and as pointless as, saying: "if you don't like the fact that Jedi Outcast isn't an RPG, go play Baldur's Gate." I mean what does that mean? It's meaningless and offensive.
Originally posted by Dark_One:
The whining people, like the guy who started this thread, don't know a thing about RP'ing. I can imagine you in a RPG. With your lols, rofls and other dumb things.What does this mean? Never mind, I don't really want to know. :)
Originally posted by Dark_One:
And saying bowing is RP'ing isn't true either. Someone said that you use your model to do an emote. That isn't RP'ing. You shoot people with your model too, is that RP'ing???Shooting people is the aim of the game in guns-servers. Bowing is not the aim of the game in duel servers. That's pretty much the distinction you're looking for.
Secondly, bowing and using other emotes, is roleplaying. If they were in the same room, would the fanboys who use +amkiss really be snogging each other? If they were playing a game in the same room, would they stand up and bow to each other? Of course not, they're using their models to act out some sort of wierd fantasy-experience-thing. Bowing adds nothing to duels, any more than kissing each other through the medium of JO models does.
On a side note, bowing doesn't automatically show respect, every fanboy bows before a duel and insults you after it, win or lose. The people who say "good game" or "well played" the most are also the people who don't give a fig about bowing, in my experience.
Originally posted by shock ~ unnamed:
In the past I did a really fast one and they said "That's not a real bow, do it again the right way so we can begin". I mean really, come one people Star Wars was never that damn fruity the last time I checked.The fanboys that whinge about "being starwarsy" rarely know anything much about Star Wars in the first place. Heck, they've probably only seen the prequels. It's not Star Wars that's fruity. ;)
These long posts are hurting my eyes. >8(
"The whining people, like the guy who started this thread, don't know a thing about RP'ing. I can imagine you in a RPG. With your lols, rofls and other dumb things."
What's wrong with "lol?"
And how are the rest dumb? :rolleyes: You use those abreviations to express yourself.
How about we keep things simple......if you don't like RPG, don't play it. But don't complain about others that do, just go and find your 'style' of JO to play-there are plenty of servers out there. Let others play the game they want to be played. :cool:
Sure and let's all tell people "hey you don't like profanity just find a server where people do not curse".
No one hates “role players”.
Most of them play on isolated servers and don’t bother anyone.
We hate fanboy “bow or we’ll vote you off” saber noobies.
Big difference, and all fanboy saber noobies must be purged through an onslaught of laming until FFA servers are once again a place where people can go to actually…
play FFA.
RPGing is ok with me, as long as I'm not forced to do it too... But I do think that you shouldn't kill anyone with saber off (unless he doesn't respond to your chat, I ask if they wanna fight or not - no response = kill) and if they bow... I just nod my head, but I don't kill 'em...
And if someone tries to kill me with saber off, I'll just humiliate him by kicking him to death with saber off, MWUAHAHHAHAAAA!!!
Darn, another step closer to the dark side ;)
"No one hates “role players”.
Most of them play on isolated servers and don’t bother anyone.
We hate fanboy “bow or we’ll vote you off” saber noobies.
Big difference, and all fanboy saber noobies must be purged through an onslaught of laming until FFA servers are once again a place where people can go to actually…
play FFA."
That basically sums up exactly what I am trying to say.
Nice work.
Originally posted by Bacon00
"No one hates “role players”.
Most of them play on isolated servers and don’t bother anyone.
We hate fanboy “bow or we’ll vote you off” saber noobies.
Big difference, and all fanboy saber noobies must be purged through an onslaught of laming until FFA servers are once again a place where people can go to actually…
play FFA."In that case, yes. Kill all the fanboys. :p
Never met anyone who said: "bow or I don't fight you" Even I would kill them for saying that.
And saying things like: lol, rofl etc ... will likely get you kicked in a real CRPG.
Like said above, if you don't like those things then just stand there and let them bow. When they're done finish them of.
LOL this Thread owns. Lets form a Group to Unite the "Elite" and the "Tru RPers" to Eradicate and Ultimately Destory the Fanboys. Like um *doesnt feel like scroliing up to see* that guy said The Way you play is like a Religon its fine where its Practice but dont go force it on others.
Hekx is kinda right too RPers stick to their own Servers and in all honesty a LOT of Servers that label their Servers as "RPG" and include the "Serious Roleplayers Only" are usually the worst RPG Servers. A Lot of people who think they are RPers suck at RPing and only Abuse Admin and other lame Crap. I am Getting a Dedicated T3 server soon Dedicated for The RPG Mod thats in progress and the Elite RPing Clubs such as RPI,RA,and KOA,and any other unknown groups can come here also that way all the "True RPers" have somewhere to call home. This wont really help any of you cause us RPers arent those Fanboy peeps which you will have coming to your Server but they will probly come to ours and try to Turn it into a Dueling Saber down=peace Crap Server (in an RPG Saber down does not Mean peace lol)
--edit oh and everything below Now as for the bowing.
was so damn funny I have seen those same exact people and I usually Slice them why they scan the ground for 45 minutes looking for diff formations in the grounds texture that look like Jedis from SW Movies.
I had two guys "protest my lack of honor" by simply standing there and saying "I refuse to duel you" when it was their turn.
This was on Infinite (European FF duel server) two days ago.
Why did I have no honor?
Because I made the stupid mistake of going to a Full Force duel server looking to... Full Force duel.
You see being the gay/lame/honor less/noob that I am I didn't know on Full Force servers when someone demands (not asks) that you do not use Force you are supposed to comply.
Him: "No Force No Throw No Kick"
Me: no
Him: "I said NO FORCE NO THROW NO KICK"
Me: no
Him: **** YOU I 'M NOT GOING TO FIGHT YOUR ***** ***
Hence I was branded a lamer and my emotional scars have yet to heal to this day.
:cry6:
It's all very well calling RPGers 'saber noobies', but in my experience (and I did play MP non stop for 11 months), the people who bow are the ones who are the most experienced and have respect for their fellow players. I don't think it's fun to go into a game will a bunch of people just swinging their sabers around killing everything in sight. Is that 'fun'? Not in my opinion. I'd much rather play with people with 'skill', and the ones I think have the most 'skill' are the people who actually take the time to realise that there is more to this game than winning.
What is wrong with acknowledging each other at the start of a fight? What is wrong with letting the other person know you arn't about to slice them up when they arn't ready? Nothing imo. I'm not saying you have to RPG, I'm saying there is nothing wrong with people who do, so just let them get on with it and let's keep the servers a fun place to play for everyone.
If you don't like the rules laid down by a server, don't waste your time moaning about it, go find another server to play on whose rules you agree with, simple as that.
If you don't like the rules laid down by a server, don't waste your time moaning about it, go find another server to play on whose rules you agree with, simple as that.
Sigh. leXX, you have to grasp the distinction: Fanboys don't stay on duel servers with rules about bowing. They come to OUR servers and try to IMPOSE their stupid rules. THAT'S what it's all about.
I've never played on a server with a rule saying "you must bow before a duel" in my LIFE. The FANBOYS still popped up and tried to make me though. And god forgive me, I did it just for a quiet life. Well not anymore.
Crush fanboys!
What is wrong with acknowledging each other at the start of a fight? What is wrong with letting the other person know you arn't about to slice them up when they arn't ready? Nothing imo.Bowing doesn't mean ANY of those things. Every other fanboy lamer, when he's dubbed you "dishonourable", bows at you and tries to hit you when you return that bow. Fanboys are untrustworthy scum.
I've had this argument far too many times in the old multiplayer stragegy forums, and I'm certainly not about to get into it yet again, so I'll just say this and leave it at that:
If someone visits your server and you don't like they way they play, kick them, quite simple really. If your not the admin of the server, leave and find another, quite simple really. With the amount of servers out there, why on earth would anyone stay on a server or let someone stay on a server when they are being annoyed by them. It just doesn't make any sense.
I was an admin of a duel server (hermes place), and let me say this, it was the best god damn duel server out there. Our 'rules' where quite simple, have fun. If an idiot came on the server acting like a jerk, he was kicked without hesitation. Noone was forced to bow, but the saber down rule was enforced. All that was asked of people was that they showed their fellow players respect, and that kept everyone coming back day after day.
If your not the admin of the server, leave and find another, quite simple really. With the amount of servers out there, why on earth would anyone stay on a server or let someone stay on a server when they are being annoyed by them. It just doesn't make any sense.Pfft, and let the fanboys take over the servers and turn them into little slices of errant RPG hell? Not on your life. You do what you like on your server, I'll combat the fanboys on the servers I will frequent.
It's quite fanboy to kick people because you "don't like the way they play" by the way. Breach of rules should be the only reason for a kick, anything else is a sub-par kiddie clan server.
DAMNIT NOT RPG HELL STOP SAYING RPG!!!!! Fanboys are not RPers!!! you are giving "Us" a bad name now cut it out!
Originally posted by Spider AL
Pfft, and let the fanboys take over the servers and turn them into little slices of errant RPG hell? Not on your life. You do what you like on your server, I'll combat the fanboys on the servers I will frequent.
You love the word 'fanboy' don't you?
Then combat them by all means, but by that, you are presuming you are in the right.
It's quite fanboy to kick people because you "don't like the way they play" by the way. Breach of rules should be the only reason for a kick, anything else is a sub-par kiddie clan server.
Did I say I kicked ppl because I didn't like the way they played?? No I didn't. You are the one moaning about the way ppl play, not me. And our server was far from a clan server.
You love the word 'fanboy' don't you?Fanboys are what I and others have been talking about the whole thread.
Then combat them by all means, but by that, you are presuming you are in the right.I do presume so. Trying to impose non-existent rules onto public servers that have no such rules, must be combatted. The fanboys must be combatted. Crush all fanboys.
Did I say I kicked ppl because I didn't like the way they played?? No I didn't.You said this:
If someone visits your server and you don't like they way they play, kick them, quite simple really.So you're advising people to kick players for such a reason.
I disagree with that advice. I think it's thoroughly reprehensible frankly. I've played on too many servers (public game networks servers mind you) where the admins kicked people who killed them on the flimsy pretext of "not liking the way they played." I was merely fortunate never to be kicked from any server for the same, petty reasons.
You are the one moaning about the way ppl play, not me. And our server was far from a clan server.I'm moaning about fanboys. Fanboys don't play. They whine.
So you're advising people to kick players for such a reason.
I disagree with that advice. I think it's thoroughly reprehensible frankly. I've played on too many servers (public game networks servers mind you) where the admins kicked people who killed them on the flimsy pretext of "not liking the way they played." I was merely fortunate never to be kicked from any server for the same, petty reasons.
I'm not disagreeing with you. People shouldn't be allowed to come on to a server and impose their own personal rules. I'm asking, what are you gonna do, argue with them for half an hour on whether you should bow or not? If a person does wanna stand there arguing about the rules of a server, they are considered a jerk imo and would be kicked.
I never had that problem because if you don't want to bow, fair enough and likewise, if you bow, fair enough. And again, I never kicked anyone because I didn't like the way they played (actual combat, not talk), I kicked them if they acted like jerks.
I have fond memories of joining a full-force guns server, getting a few kills, then mysteriously getting kicked (incidently, can we have a proper kick message? i'm sick of the vague "server disconnected"), I rejoin and ask why I was kicked and they said it was because I was using a gun.
Now when I originally joined the server there was no greet message, nobody complained when I killed them, I just got kicked after about a minute... for using a gun on a full-force guns-enabled server...
I never kicked anyone because I didn't like the way they played (actual combat, not talk),That's a good thing, Lexxy. However you have recommended that everyone else should kick players when they don't like the way those players play. That's not good.
I kicked them if they acted like jerks.And who defines what "acting like a jerk" is? You, I suppose. Well if you're paying for the server you can do what you like, but "acting like a jerk" is hardly concrete enough as a concept to base a rule around. A simple rule like "no swearing," or "no abusing other players textually" is good, and leaves no scope for malicious admins to abuse their powers.
I'm not disagreeing with you. People shouldn't be allowed to come on to a server and impose their own personal rules. I'm asking, what are you gonna do, argue with them for half an hour on whether you should bow or not?What you do, is kill them. All fanboys must be killed and stomped upon ingame, none can be allowed to take control of public servers, and what's REALLY important is that serious players band together to prevent the fanboys ruining the upcoming game with their endless whining to Raven about hardwiring their silly wants and needs into the game through patching, as happened in JO 1.03.
Detritic's most recent post highlights the problem with fanboys in all positions, powerful or otherwise. They're hypocrites with a limited understanding of the game and of basic internet civility.
Indeedski. I would have left straight away if they asked me, explaining that it was a sabers game. I get no joy or fulfillment about playing people who have no interest in fighting back.
Originally posted by Spider AL
[B]That's a good thing, Lexxy. However you have recommended that everyone else should kick players when they don't like the way those players play. That's not good.
If a person does wanna stand there arguing about the rules of a server, they are considered a jerk imo and would be kicked.
If you don't agree with me, fine, everyone is entitled to their opinion.
And who defines what "acting like a jerk" is? You, I suppose.
Yep.
Well if you're paying for the server you can do what you like, but "acting like a jerk" is hardly concrete enough as a concept to base a rule around. A simple rule like "no swearing," or "no abusing other players textually" is good, and leaves no scope for malicious admins to abuse their powers.
Do I really need to define what acting like a jerk means. I think it's pretty obvious to anyone who the jerks are.
What you do, is kill them. All fanboys must be killed and stomped upon ingame, none can be allowed to take control of public servers, and what's REALLY important is that serious players band together to prevent the fanboys ruining the upcoming game with their endless whining to Raven about hardwiring their silly wants and needs into the game through patching, as happened in JO 1.03.
And what do you do if you can't kill them. What if you loose every single match against them? (And I don't wanna hear, I would win because I'm so brilliant).
Originally posted by leXX:
And what do you do if you can't kill them. What if you loose every single match against them? (And I don't wanna hear, I would win because I'm so brilliant).
I doubt if any player who practices more than twice a week would be unable to defeat a fanboy. Fanboys spend all their time whining because they lose, if they spent time practicing they would no longer be fanboys.
Besides, the effort is the important thing. If you're on a public game-network server with no rules, and the fanboys insist that you bow, don't bow. If they kickvote you off, return with your friends and crush them. If the ADMIN of the server is a fanboy, complain to the game network, and make sure your friends complain too.
Serious players must stick together, because you can be sure that the fanboys stick together like little glue-covered... umm... fanboys.
Originally posted by leXX:
If a person does wanna stand there arguing about the rules of a server, they are considered a jerk imo and would be kicked.
If you don't agree with me, fine, everyone is entitled to their opinion.Lexx, that's not the relevant quote. This is the relevant quote from your post, the one I quoted and replied to previously:
Originally posted by leXX:
If someone visits your server and you don't like they way they play, kick them,Now there's no excuse for that. Reprehensible.
And by that quote, I meant arguing with you, not their actual combat. I would of thought that was pretty obvious by now judging by all my other posts.
Well you do it your way, and I'll do it my way and we will just leave it at that.
And by that quote, I meant arguing with you, not their actual combat. I would of thought that was pretty obvious by now judging by all my other posts.I'm not sure how the "way people play" is in any way related to whether they argue or not, but if that's what you meant then that's okay. If I were you I'd be a little more careful about how I worded things in future though. A mod on the major JK forums giving a green light to server admins to abuse their powers, intentionally or unintentionally, is no laughing matter.
Well you do it your way, and I'll do it my way and we will just leave it at that.Absolutely. As I've said previously, if you pay for the server you can do whatever you wish on it.
The concerns of fair-play and justice for players (and the eradication of fanboys) must be paramount in the minds of all server-admins however, regardless of what sort of server they're running.
The thing I love about the pseudo-Rpers or the fanboys is that they'll tell you that you aren't a real jedi when you don't comply to their rules.
I've decided that whenever I encounter this stuff again, I will be prepared to "counter-rpg".
My counter-rpg system is simple. If I am playing on a public server that does not posess clearly marked rules such as "this here be an RPG server, here be me rulz", then the counter-rpg system is in effect.
1.) When I am asked to bow, I simply reply "sorry, I'm a Sith Lord, Sith Lords don't bow". An alternative to that is "I'm a mercenary similar to Aurra Sing, you know, the jedi hopeful turned mercenary. So I use a lightsaber and guns... and I don't bow".
2.) When someone has their saber off, and there are no 'rulz' stipulating that saber off should be honored, then I am going to kill them. that's just how it's done. If its clear to me that they are in some deep, dark corner, far away from combat, and they are not moving, have a text box over their head, etc., I leave them alone. Otherwise, dead meat. If they are in the middle of a battle field and turn on the text box, sorry, you're dead. I don't have time to plan an attack on you, only to see the magic box appear. When someone claims that I have no honor though, I simply reply "sorry, I'm a Sith Lord/Aurra Sing/Boba Fett/Jabba the Hutt/The Emperor/the guy who killed moisture farmers from Sulon/Darth Vader. I'm a killer". This also solves the "you have no rhyme or reason for kills, you're lame" argument. Because now you have a reason. Of course you'd kill everything in sight.
3.) When the usual 'lame!' messages come up for various reasons, such as intelligently pushing my opponent off the ledge, as opposed to fighting them head on, or using a rocket launcher, or using my sniper rifle to knock them out, or kicking them when they try to hump me with their lightsaber, or just using my dark side powers to vanquish them (there was a reason i had them in the first place, right?), once again, I can simply say "sorry, according to my code of 'honourz', I am a Sith Lord/Aurra Sing/Boba Fett/your worst nightmare, and therefore honor has no place in my character. I am indeed adhering to the Star Warz univerze, because when I watched the movie, I know @#$! well that Jango Fett did not play fair, nor did he bow to Mace Windu before having his head cut off!"
And that ends my Counter-RPG system. My apologies to any of the REAL RPG servers, players, admins, etc., who have clearly designated games and servers. To the ones coming to the public servers... you plagued us with your rules. That's fine. You've somehow 'justified' your actions, and now, in a Star Wars-esque fashion, I have justified my own. Take it.
Originally posted by Spider AL
I'm not sure how the "way people play" is in any way related to whether they argue or not, but if that's what you meant then that's okay. If I were you I'd be a little more careful about how I worded things in future though. A mod on the major JK forums giving a green light to server admins to abuse their powers, intentionally or unintentionally, is no laughing matter.
Which is why I made it clear in all my posts after you picked up on that one particular sentence exactly what I meant by it.
Originally posted by Doctor Shaft:
I can simply say "sorry, according to my code of 'honourz', I am a Sith Lord/Aurra Sing/Boba Fett/your worst nightmare, and therefore honor has no place in my character. I am indeed adhering to the Star Warz univerze, because when I watched the movie, I know DAMN well that Jango Fett did not play fair, nor did he bow to Mace Windu before having his head cut off!" Hmm, honour is very important to me when I play online, so I'm saddened to see that the fanboys have almost succeeded in making it a dirty word.
Honour is:
Not swearing. (edit: Not screaming profanities at other players when they beat you or you beat them, that is)
Not abusing other players textually.
Not cheating.
Not being a hypocrite.
Not forcing your own rules of play onto others.
Not whining.
That's honour. Fanboys don't know the meaning of the word.
Originally posted by leXX:
Which is why I made it clear in all my posts after you picked up on that one particular sentence exactly what I meant by it.Perhaps so, though there is clear and then there is clear. If I were you I would have edited it out and posted a retraction, but now that you've made it totally clear that you didn't mean it, there's no need for any more argument, and we're talking on the same page, right?
Originally posted by Spider AL
[B]Hmm, honour is very important to me when I play online, so I'm saddened to see that the fanboys have almost succeeded in making it a dirty word.
Honour is:
Not swearing. (edit: Not screaming profanities at other players when they beat you or you beat them, that is)
Not abusing other players textually.
Not cheating.
Not being a hypocrite.
Not forcing your own rules of play onto others.
Not whining.
That's honour. Fanboys don't know the meaning of the word.
I totally agree with this. Perhaps I have misunderstood exactly what you consider a 'fanboy' to be. Explain to me what you think a 'fanboy' is.
I totally agree with this. Perhaps I have misunderstood exactly what you consider a 'fanboy' to be. Explain to me what you think a 'fanboy' is.Well a lot of fans who don't use the term "fanboy" a lot tend to think it refers just to fans. But it doesn't of course, I'm a Star Wars fan myself, a proper fan, dedicated to trivia and to a certain extent, sad.
But fans are good people. Fanboys are completely separate.
Who knows how the word came into popular use. Someone suggested recently that the word "fanboy" might have arisen when people needed to describe IMMATURE fans, hence the word "boy." So fanboys describe immature fans... people who have a limited knowledge of the subject they profess to be a fan of, and behave in a very immature fashion.
And since Jedi Outcast, fanboy has been used to describe those players who whine a lot, and use sort of flimsy Star Wars excuses to bolster their whining.
For example: A fanboy is the type of person who might get killed, and whine saying "you're a lamer!" when they're asked WHY they called their killer a lamer, they'd say something like "coz that dont happen in the films" or something of that sort. They usually band together and kickvote the people that beat them off the server, and then wander round spinning and bowing and amkissing, because they really don't enjoy playing the game properly, and just use it to while away their time and, yes, to roleplay to a certain extent. (Ronin, I'm not calling them pure RPGers, mind you. ;) )
The main behaviour that defines a fanboy is: The fanboy will attempt to force some sort of wierd rule onto whatever public server they join. Like bowing, but even worse: Duels on the platform in a guns FFA. And as extreme as "no gunz" on a guns-ffa or ctf public server.
And fanboy-players have infested ALL gaming communities, but they're most concentrated in the JO community for obvious reasons.
Well thank you for clearing that up. I have a feeling we have been arguing over nothing. I thought you considered all people who bowed a fanboy, and that is what I was defending as someone who bowed and is proud of that fact.
lol the other day i was playing on jedibattlefield jk2++ server and i was just messing around sniping people. then one guy goes "i really hate it when people script their snipes i mean god cant they just get some skill?" so naturally i just ignored him and kept sniping him and he kept complaining saying that i have a snipe scripted blah blah blah. so then i finally get fed up with him and ask "do you know what a script actually is?" and he says "yea you're hacking your snipes so that you always hit me and i cant dodge." now... in JK2++ snipes always penetrate saber defense and the only way to avoid the is by using seeing. also if he actually knew what a SCRIPT is he'd know that it's impossible to script snipes. this is an example of a fanboy an immature player who makes baseless accusations because his own skill is vastly inferior to the skill level of others and must console himself by deluding himself into believing that everyone else hacks/cheats/scripts. these people then band together and votekick others from playing simply because they are superior gamers.
It is annoying, but ultimately, what can you do. They are not likely to change if we simply take the bait (I am sure that some of these little buggers do it to try andget a rise out of the veteran players)
As with most bullies, dumb asses and lamers, the only way to get the message across is to boycott them and their friends and servers. They will happily play in their own groups, get bored senseless, and give up when no new competition is forth coming.
As long as we PROPOERLY honourable players such as yourselves stick together on this, and dont arrgravate the problem, they will figure it out, and stay clear. If they do venture out, then NAIL THEM, but else leave them be.
It just one of those little things which are small, but are so INCREDIBLY annoying that it just isnt right in the cosmic scheme of things.
I only see logic in the following:
Acceptable behavior starts and ends with the server owners and/or admins assigned by the server owners. For better or for worse a person's server is their own purchased and maintained virtual world where user particpation is voluntary.
All behavior on servers is approved either directly or indirectly by the admins. On one end of the spectrum you'll find servers with clearly marked, explicit rules enforced by admins that regularly watch the server like hawks. On the other, servers completely devoid of any admin presence where the only rules are actually the server settings selected when the multiplayer game was created (voting, friendly saber, allow saber lock, etc).
For the latter, it's worth pointing out that if a server has no admin presence and has voting enabled, you can bet the majority is going to rule. Not that the majority or their playstyle is any more valid than any other group or playstyle. It's just that what someone wants can become irrelevant in the face of explicit server rules, general server settings, and whimsicial, immature, or unintelligent admins.
I've resigned myself to the fact that all types of server admins will enact their right to mold their virtual domain as they see fit. Most of the time this means they'll do something I don't approve of and don't want to be around. The server has then lost my patronage and I move on. Rinse. Repeat.
This day and age it's a frustrating, time-consuming process to find a good public server for any fps given my attitudes and playstyle. That I can no longer find a good public server with the frequency that I used to is a bitter pill to swallow. Perhaps I'm not doing enough but that is my reality; my expectations couldn't get much lower in this regard.
My guess is that more people play JO and will play JA on public servers as "fanboys" or what have you than as clanners or fps purists. Again, I'm not campaigning to win the hearts and minds of one group or another here; this is a simple reality of numbers. If the latter groups are concerned about their representation on servers as part of the JA community, I hope their expectations are grounded enough to expect a long hard struggle ahead of them.
edit: spelling
i was just wondering if any fanboys would like to defend themselves in their actions, fanboys meaning the ppl who go onto servers w/ no rules about lightsaber off = peace or those who won't fight when ppl don't bow.
Originally posted by DeTRiTiC-iQ
I have fond memories of joining a full-force guns server, getting a few kills, then mysteriously getting kicked (incidently, can we have a proper kick message? i'm sick of the vague "server disconnected"), I rejoin and ask why I was kicked and they said it was because I was using a gun.
Now when I originally joined the server there was no greet message, nobody complained when I killed them, I just got kicked after about a minute... for using a gun on a full-force guns-enabled server...
Yeah, I would like a proper kick message as well. Heh, it still happens to me today. I've made many enemies just because they were killed by me. It doesn't matter how. They just whine about how I'm a noob because I killed them with (insert weapon here).
Originally posted by Krayt Tion
I only see logic in the following:
Acceptable behavior starts and ends with the server owners and/or admins assigned by the server owners. For better or for worse a person's server is their own purchased and maintained virtual world where user particpation is voluntary.
All behavior on servers is approved either directly or indirectly by the admins. On one end of the spectrum you'll find servers with clearly marked, explicit rules enforced by admins that regularly watch the server like hawks. On the other, servers completely devoid of any admin presence where the only rules are actually the server settings selected when the multiplayer game was created (voting, friendly saber, allow saber lock, etc).
For the latter, it's worth pointing out that if a server has no admin presence and has voting enabled, you can bet the majority is going to rule. Not that the majority or their playstyle is any more valid than any other group or playstyle. It's just that what someone wants can become irrelevant in the face of explicit server rules, general server settings, and whimsicial, immature, or unintelligent admins.
I've resigned myself to the fact that all types of server admins will enact their right to mold their virtual domain as they see fit. Most of the time this means they'll do something I don't approve of and don't want to be around. The server has then lost my patronage and I move on. Rinse. Repeat.
This day and age it's a frustrating, time-consuming process to find a good public server for any fps given my attitudes and playstyle. That I can no longer find a good public server with the frequency that I used to is a bitter pill to swallow. Perhaps I'm not doing enough but that is my reality; my expectations couldn't get much lower in this regard.
My guess is that more people play JO and will play JA on public servers as "fanboys" or what have you than as clanners or fps purists. Again, I'm not campaigning to win the hearts and minds of one group or another here; this is a simple reality of numbers. If the latter groups are concerned about their representation on servers as part of the JA community, I hope their expectations are grounded enough to expect a long hard struggle ahead of them.
edit: spelling
Fine words, but let me ask you this:
You acknowledge the fact that the server administrators are going to enforce rules, yet you can't seem to somewhat bend to accomodate? You can't reach some sort of a compromise with the staff and say that... you may be an ******* at times and have to take a few heads off of a few idiots from time to time?
Ahh, the endless scheme of what ifs...
However, there's no better way to coin the downfall of JKII. Right now everyone's blame is focused on the fanboys and their extensive rules. I believe, on the other hand, that everyone here played a part of the downfall of JKII in one way for another. While the fanboys were creating a emotional hurricane of epic proportions, the ones who knew what they were talking out were pushed to the backburner. I think too much went on in terms of public opinion, that we now fight with glowsticks, not the representation of a weapon from an age's past.
The divisions with the mod community didn't help much either.
I just find it trivial and somewhat amusing that there are people in this very thread that are trying to pinpoint the source of the problem on just one distinct theory, and put the rest on the backburner just as fast as they (Raven and LucasArts) did to those who had reasonable arguements in terms of the roughshod patches.
If you want to solve the problem, you got to get to equal grounds on what the problem is in the first place.
I don't see that happening here...
EDIT: Oh, and Aoshi, I think now would be the proper time to bring out the STFU n00b flash.
Good post Rad.
Now here's the problem (hehehe): JO has two totally contradictory player groups: the COMPETITIVE player and the FRIENDLY player. This isn't to say competitive players can't be friendly -- I'm defining friendly players as people who expect friendly, chatty, slow-paced gameplay (*yawn*), and wish to enforce it.
Anyways, like it or not, there's gonna be alot of fanboys around in JA. You can't screen em' out, and Raven wouldn't want to in the first place. But.... I think if both player types had an institution in JO, and stopped butting heads, then they could tolerate each other, and you'd probably see alot more "friendly" players trying competition. But as it stands they all use the same gametype. There's often no way of knowing what you'll find when you join a server, so there's constant conflicts. Now, when friendly players get bored of their servers, they're already too bitter and hateful of the "lamers" to try playing competitively. So they quit the game. I think we're seeing a fatal cut in the community that's keeping most newbies from ever becoming skilled, or even learning the meaning of the word.
IMO, Raven has to make an official distinction between these two castes. In-game, where nobody can miss it. After all, JO is really a completely different game for each of these two groups, even if the game's settings are identical. Sadly we can discuss how people feel on these forums, make websites about the problem, try to educate the hordes of fan-brats, but the bulk of them aren't going to read any of this and we'll have the same problems in JA as JO.
But what if, in JA's Game Creation menu, Raven added a small comsmetic option at the top of the screen? I'm not talking about anything that seriously alters game settings. It's mostly there so n00b players have to SEE the distinction.
What if you could toggle "Friendly Game" or "Competitive Game" in the host options? In big, colorful, important-looking letters, so the newbies couldn't miss it. I know it'd be really condescending for you decent players, but think of the advantages! The in-game browser would show the distinction, so skilled players would know which servers were for n00bs. And if any fan-brats joined our games and bitched about "no honor," we could just say "competitive game, n00b. You're looking for a friendly game." Then they'd notice the huge, bold text, and feel embarassed, and probably steer clear until they got bored of their friendly servers.
JO already has a training mode, but most fanboys don't even know it exists, and even if they did they probably wouldn't use it. They DO want to fight after all, and kill each other, but only in a slow, tedious chatty fashion. And if they could actually put a title in game creation called "FRIENDLY GAME," then I think most of our problems would be solved.
My only worry about this idea is griefers setting traps, creating a game labelled "friendly," and gang-raping every n00b that joins their server. This kind of behaviour would be extremely bad for the system, since it'd make everybody mistrust the designations and we'd be back to the situation in JO. So.... what if all players could use the "god mode" cheat in Friendly games, and maybe even squelch any player they want? That would allow all newbies to choose when they want to be attacked, and silence anyone who taunts them. That should keep friendly servers friendly.
*yawn* getting bored just thinking about it. Good thing I'll never play on one.
My only other solution to the fanboys is to remove voting from ALL gametypes. But I doubt that'll work, as fanboys can probably just mod the voting back in, or something similarly fascist.
Rad, I can't say I understand your point.
I wasn't giving advice to Raven, I was speaking to the "competitive" players in this thread.
:confused:
Since I run a "competitive only" server anyone who comes on my server and bows I can consider a "lamer" and ban them?
I can see it now “WTF can you believe this crap, some admin booted me just for bowing!?”
Sounds a little extreme right?
Not really.
Why?
We constantly get kicked just for playing.
And people wonder why we dislike fanboy saber noobies.
Take your codes of honor crap and stay on Omni mod servers please, we won’t bother you and you will never be plagued my masses of “lamers” ever again.
Unnamed:
Hehehe.... ok! Now both sides can waste 90% of their time joining servers and immediately getting booted. Rince, repeat! YAY! There's equality for ya!
Damn commies.
But seriously, I wish they were reading the forums right now, and they listened to you. But they won't. They're clueless, and aren't gonna understand unless it's written in crayon for them, in-game. That's what I figure anyway.
Originally posted by shock ~ unnamed
Since I run a "competitive only" server anyone who comes on my server and bows I can consider a "lamer" and ban them?
I can see it now “WTF can you believe this crap, some admin booted me just for bowing!?”
Sounds a little extreme right?
Not really.
Why?
We constantly get kicked just for playing.
And people wonder why we dislike fanboy saber noobies.
Take your codes of honor crap and stay on Omni mod servers please, we won’t bother you and you will never be plagued my masses of “lamers” ever again.
Funny how you are so ready to tread the same path they have already paved for you.
Let them bow, just don't take their whining when they get a strong slash to the head for it.
Sort of like taking the higher road, n'est pas?
Rad:
High road my ass. That's already been tried. To death. Works as good as Unnamed's plan, I expect. And the JO community's still in its death throes. Just as JA will be a year or so after release, looks like.
Maybe we should review what the "problem," is, just so we're all on the same track. Heheh.
umm I was being sarcastic.
We only kick/ban people when they reconnect/drop other players during duel mode.