Originally posted by greedo626
it only takes a little pot to do alot of damage.
A few grams of concentrated nicotine is enough to kill you.
Same goes for caffeine, or so I've heard.
Originally posted by C'jais
A few grams of concentrated nicotine is enough to kill you.
Same goes for caffeine, or so I've heard.
alcohol too.
but I can't understand why anyone would drink alcohol or smoke cigarettes or weed or anything for that matter. I'm confounded by some of the things people will drink or inhale:confused:
Seen anyone who's life has gone down the drain because of using too much alcohol? :rolleyes:
Drunkards are all over the place, everywhere.
Alcohol is addictive. Tobacco is addictive. Sex is addictive. Drugs are addictive.
Some people lack willpower, it's that simple.
Legalising drugs would bring us more problems. One of the major points is that drugs are insanely expensive atm and if you do heavy drugs, you won't be working (earning) much.
Take a wild guess: of all the stolen car stereos, how many were stolen just because some loser needed money for drugs? 90%? 95%?
Originally posted by Luc Solar
One of the major points is that drugs are insanely expensive atm and if you do heavy drugs, you won't be working (earning) much.
Take a guess as to why drugs are so expensive.
Drug lords could charge 2000$ for a hit, and those losers would still pay it.
actually i used to smoke cigarettes they arent addictive. i havent smoked a cigarette in 4 years. weed i smoke because first i enjoy it and second it helps me with my adhd. i used to get it with a prescription until bush made all forms of marijuana illegal in texas.
Originally posted by JM Qui-Gon Jinn
As there are LOADS of more people driving cars than the amount using pot, that argument doesn't fit at all. And I belive there is quite few of the drug users that drive cars.You missed my point. The whole point of the propaganda is to find a negative group of people, or negative act, and associate it with marijuana by saying those who do the negative act also do marijuana. But that in no way means that those who do marijuana also do the negative act. I was being sarcastic with the car comment. Of course that would not be true, as driving a car isn't a negative act. But lets just say that most child molestors smoked marijuana. Then it could be said that smoking marijuana will make you molest children. Well, that's entirely untrue. Just as the "gateway drug" statement has no basis of truth either. That is how propaganda works, by spreading half-truths and preying on the those who do not wish to think for themselves.
If you make it legal, it will be more common.Yep, more common then common. Would that make it super common? I'm saying that it doesn't matter either way, legal or not, it's always gonna be there, easily accesible in almost any clime.
A fact. But if you don't belive it, that's your problem. If you really trust a few guys, who has no medical education, saying pot doesn't harm you in any way instead of beliving all the thousands of doctors who know perfectly well the mental damages pot does, then that's your problem. I'll guess you'll soon say stabbing yourself in the stomach with a knife doesn't do any harm.Ok, it's a fact. Maybe you could describe what "childish" means in this sense. I'm suprised that thousands of doctors could only come up with the word "childish" as the best description. Sounds more like an insult to me, rather then a scientific opinion.
I know saying marijuana didn't hurt anyone was a false statement. Just trying to get my point across in a poor manner.
I'm not saying that there aren't downsides to smoking weed. Yeah, if you do it on a consistent basis, you'll end up an unmotivated slob. I don't really believe there are long term effects concerning brain function with moderate use of marijuana, after these users stop using. While they are still smoking on a regular (daily) basis, I could see that might be true. But not so bad in my opinion. I'm pointing out that weed isn't the scourge of the planet. Sure, there are some negative things that result from it. But nothing on the epic scale that some of you would have us believe. Yeah, some people crap their lives away on weed. You may know them, and I believe you when you say they have ruined their lives. But I have never seen anyone "ruin" their lives with marijuana. Hell, I've done lotsa drugs, with lotsa people, and I don't really think I've seen too many people ruin their lives because of drugs. That would be because I don't hang out with the scum of the earth. I'm not saying it doesn't happen, I'm just saying that I distance myself from those who are prone to that. Because these people have more problems then just drugs. Yet you associate all the negative aspects of their lives with the common thing: marijuana. Sort of like that propaganda thing I explained at the beginning of this post.
That's the point, I'm not dumb enough to smoke. Yes, I figured that out. That statement meant you are pretty opinionated about something you have no experience with, and the only knowledge of it is force fed to you. I'm not trying to sway you to believe marijuana is good. I could care less which way you lean. But you might as well be on the payroll for the DEA with all the crap you spread here.
You like that sig Shock? :) That has to be one of the funniest things I've read in a long time, I just had to put it there.
:lol: I do believe I've misjudged you, Munik. You aight, son, you aight!
I don't understand why so many people are so closed-minded.
As far as I know, smoking weed causes a buildup of THC around brain cells that control memory. The buildup is naturally cleaned up over a period of time (not more than a month.) If you smoked way too much- over half an ounce a day for a month - the buildup would be too much and it would kill some of the cells. No one smokes that much, so it doesn't harm, or permanently affect, your brain.
Whether or not it causes cancer is still being debated, but as far as I know it is not as bad as cigs here. It is certainly harmful to your lungs- you are breathing in flaming material after all- but again, as far as I know, it's not nearly as harmful as cigarettes, which have tar and artificial additives. The worst you are likely to get is bronchitis and/or a smoker's cough.
Marijuana has many uses as a medicine as well. It calms spasming muscles and settles upset stomachs. It gives an appetite to cancer patients who would normally throw up whatever they ate. For more information:
http://www.medmjscience.org/Pages/reports/nihpt1.html)
There is no evidence that it is physically addictive. Of course it is mentally addictive to some people. So is anything. When playing games you are harming yourself as well- sitting inside on your ass for hours on end is detrimental to your health. Eating bacon cheeseburgers is unhealthy too.
You may know that cocaine releases dopamine, giving a happy, contented feeling. Dopamine is the 'reward' your body gives for eating, having sex, and other things. So by eating you are rewarded with a 'buzz'.
--------------
Enough about the physical properties of it- I prefer to talk about the principle of prohibition. I believe that my body is my own and I should be able to do whatever I want as long as it does not harm others. Fast food is bad for me, but I still can choose what to eat. Why can't I choose to smoke weed?
It's fun, and pretty harmless. I'll do what I want with my own body.
I have to finish this up so I'll end by saying that weed does affect judgement and reaction time so you shouldn't drive while high.
*jumps in without having read the entire thread (yeah, I know that it's a bad habit)*
Never did drink, smoke, or do drugs other than pharmaceutics like antibiotics and headache cures, and I even keep those to a minimum (everything has side effects, and every pain has a cause, so if you can sit out the headache instead of taking a pill, or even better find out what hurts and why and solve the problem, then that's better than taking a pill). Not saying that you should never use headache pills, it's just that nine times out of ten it's unnessecary.[/unnessecairily long rant with too few periods]
I find the taste of ethanol and smoke off-putting. Drugs are illegal, and in extreme cases cause insanity (which I find to be the most scary disease that exists). That's my motivation... Oh and not being in control of my own mind (related to the above comment on (in)sanity). I'm addicted to being a sentient creature.
Originally posted by Kinnopio?
Whether or not it causes cancer is still being debated, but as far as I know it is not as bad as cigs here. It is certainly harmful to your lungs- you are breathing in flaming material after all- but again, as far as I know, it's not nearly as harmful as cigarettes, which have tar and artificial additives. The worst you are likely to get is bronchitis and/or a smoker's cough.
Marijuana has many uses as a medicine as well. It calms spasming muscles and settles upset stomachs. It gives an appetite to cancer patients who would normally throw up whatever they ate. For more information:
You may know that cocaine releases dopamine, giving a happy, contented feeling. Dopamine is the 'reward' your body gives for eating, having sex, and other things. So by eating you are rewarded with a 'buzz'.
Ooooh, so many things to nitpick, sooo in need of sleep, so i'll try to keep this short.
First of all, it has been proven that one marijuana cig does as much damage to the lungs as around 5 tobacco cigs. I think that was on CNN.com, but I don't really want to look up the article, maybe some other time when i'm not tired, so basically you're messing up your lungs pretty bad whenever you smoke marijuana.
Secondly, for nearly EVERY medical use for marijuana there is a legal prescription drug without the same side-effects that'll match it. The only thing that makes marijuana somewhat unique is with cancer patients, making them hungry to eat after chemo-therapy.
Eating, while it may give me a "buzz" is necessary for me to LIVE, and coccaine is both mentally AND physically addictive, and it does damage to your mind and body.
There, i kept that pretty darn short.....
Marijuana will not cause lung cancer or damage your lungs. Smoking marijuana is what does that. Because the delivery system has negative effects in no way means the drug causes those negative effects.
That's like saying heroin causes abcesses. That's not true, it's the needle that does that.
Cocaine can really screw your nose and sinuses up if you snort it all the time. But that in no way indicates a side effect of cocaine. You could stick it up your ass to get high and then you would not have nose problems.
Pointing out negative effects associated with the method in which you choose to take a drug is a lame scare tactic.
Originally posted by ET Warrior
Secondly, for nearly EVERY medical use for marijuana there is a legal prescription drug without the same side-effects that'll match it.
That's a tough choice. Do I take the prescription drug to relieve this headache, even though the side effects can be blurry vision, nose bleeds, and stomach cramps. Or do I smoke a joint, even though the side effects can cause me to have one hell of a good time? Jeez, which one is the lesser of two evils?
Originally posted by munik
Marijuana will not cause lung cancer or damage your lungs. Smoking marijuana is what does that. Because the delivery system has negative effects in no way means the drug causes those negative effects.
That's a tough choice. Do I take the prescription drug to relieve this headache, even though the side effects can be blurry vision, nose bleeds, and stomach cramps. Or do I smoke a joint, even though the side effects can cause me to have one hell of a good time? Jeez, which one is the lesser of two evils?
And eating tobacco isn't going to give me lung cancer either...I was simply assuming they were talking about smoking marijuana, sorry, I'll be more specific next time.
And I dont know, but I've NEVER gotten blurry vision, nose bleeds, or stomach cramps from taking prescription anything..
Probaly are talking about smoking it. You can eat it, too, but that's about it for ingesting it. Most smoke I reckon. I just made the argument solely on marijuana, I thought that was what we were talking about. We could assume most people buy their marijuana from someone else, so a listed negative side effect of marijuana could be interacting with drug dealers. I'm just saying that there are an abundance of ancillary negative effects associated with marijuana. But they are seperate, not directly caused by the drug. Just trying to keep it clear.
And those side effects aren't for one real drug, they are an amalgam of some side effects I hear on TV for those prescription drug comericials.
It sometimes seem, as I were the only one in my class (7th), who haven't been drunk. Later, maybe, I'll sometimes sit and drink some beer, but I will never touch drugs!
Ok, Just to clearify....
Yes I drink, in moderation. Alcohol is legal, and I am 28 years of age. I can drink what I want, when I want, yet I use discresion. I only drink after my workday is complete, or on my off days. And sometimes I go days without anything because I tire of it. Point is, if you are of legal age, drinking is still within the rhelm of the law. Plus you go into a grocery store and buy alcohol, you don't go into any store and buy drugs. To do drugs you need a perscription from a doctor. I know, I had some codeine once perscribed for a insatiable ear-ache I had once. Knocked me out for days, during which I was in LA LA land. However Doctors go to medical school so that they perscribe the proper dose of such addictive drugs. I have known people that go addicted to Zanex, don't get me started on that bit. I seen people get it from they're doctors and sell it to each other. Jeezum Crow....
I still do not see the attraction with pot. If the stuff was legal, and in the stores, would anyone even bother? Or would they rather buy some crack on the street from somebody named "C-Dawg"? Yeah these people are pharmasists..... Remember that the FDA is here for a reason folks. Whenever you smoke or inject an illegal substance, you do not have any fancy Gov't regulations to observer the poison you put into your system. Or is that the real thrill....isn't it? I'll take my chances on a Gin and Tonic any day of the week, at least I know what is in it......
As far as drugs goes, i used to abuse them (to an extent)
I still drink fairly often, usually every other weekend (but never to get drunk)
As far as drug use went, i used Acid/LSD the most, Mushrooms, Marijuana(not a lot though, i didnt like smoking things that much), DMT (same with marajuana, didnt like smoking it...but its different). The worse mistake of my life...i used Datura, if you dont know what it is...dont bother asking because i WILL NOT tell you.
i believe the only reason drugs are illegal is because sometimes(most of the times actually) people are just simply too stupid to be responsible enough to use them thats why.
And by the way, ive been drug free for 6 some months now.
Also, a LOT of what you guys hear nowadays(some people even said a few things that are BS)...are myths created by DARE programs or Police departments to get kids to not use drugs.
Like i said before...their illegal because of people being irresponsible users, its a law to protect ourselves from ourselves.
I quote from a book I have.
*ahem*
"Stoffer som gir endrete sanse- og tankeopplevelser, det vil si hallusinasjoner, er blant annet hasj, marihuana og LSD. Disse stoffene forandrer personligheten og pеvirker i fшrste rekke tanker og fшlelser og vеre opplevelser av sanseintrykk. Misbrukere har omkommet fordi de har trodd at de kunne fly eller gjшre andre halsbrekkende handlinger. Et typisk trekk hos hasjrшykere er at han blir slшv og etter hvert uinteressert i verden rundt seg. Virkelighetsoppfatningen og evnen til е lжre blir redusert gradvis og snikende. "
Originally posted by JM Qui-Gon Jinn
I quote from a book I have.
*ahem*
Intended for me specifically? :p
"Stoffer som gir endrete sanse- og tankeopplevelser, det vil si hallusinasjoner,
I didn't know hash could make you hallucinate, but if you overdose, I suspect it might.
er blant annet hasj, marihuana og LSD. Disse stoffene forandrer personligheten
That's a bit vague. Getting a car of your own is also reported as having changed a person's personality.
Et typisk trekk hos hasjrшykere er at han blir slшv og etter hvert uinteressert i verden rundt seg. Virkelighetsoppfatningen og evnen til е lжre blir redusert gradvis og snikende. "
The same could be said for alcoholics and people overdosing on sleeping pills. Take drugs in moderation, like everything else.
Originally posted by JM Qui-Gon Jinn
"Stoffer som gir endrete sanse- og tankeopplevelser, det vil si hallusinasjoner, er blant annet hasj, marihuana og LSD. Disse stoffene forandrer personligheten og pеvirker i fшrste rekke tanker og fшlelser og vеre opplevelser av sanseintrykk. Misbrukere har omkommet fordi de har trodd at de kunne fly eller gjшre andre halsbrekkende handlinger. Et typisk trekk hos hasjrшykere er at han blir slшv og etter hvert uinteressert i verden rundt seg. Virkelighetsoppfatningen og evnen til е lжre blir redusert gradvis og snikende. "
Ummm, yeah...that's exactly what I was thinking.. so how 'bout those Lakers? :rolleyes:
Seriously: reading that stuff is like reading the ramblings of a very drunk horribly dyslexic Swede. :p
after using LSD the first time back when i was about 15 i could deffinately tell i had changed personality wise. I sensed the world in a different way that i was used to. Its weird.
edit: i cant even smoke weed anymore (even if i had the desire to do so) because it brings back nostalgia from tripping on LSD. It brings back scarry memories, imagees, feelings, thoughts that i simply dont want to experience anymore...
Originally posted by C'jais
I didn't know hash could make you hallucinate, but if you overdose, I suspect it might.
[/B]
I don't think it'll need an overdose. You probably won't get it if you only use a little, but if you use it fairly lot, then...
That's a bit vague. Getting a car of your own is also reported as having changed a person's personality.
But mostly not to the worse.
The same could be said for alcoholics and people overdosing on sleeping pills. Take drugs in moderation, like everything else.
Do you think people care if you ask them nicely to use it with moderation? Alcohol is abused quite a lot, yes, and people are overdosing on sleeping pills, yes. But that's not a reason to let people abuse drugs.
And at the last, I would just like to say a few words. If you make "lighter" drugs legal, then it is more likely that people will try them, yes? And if people try them, it is likely that they will do it again. And if they've done it two times, it is even more likely they will do it again, because if you use it, you'll get used to it, and it's not scary anymore, it's just "cool". So the drug users will do it more times. And more often. Often more drugs. And they will damage the brain beyond repair. And of course, people do lots of stupid things when using high amounts of these "lighter" drugs. I may mention an 11-year old girl who was killed by a person high on pot. The highness was the reason for the murder. And not only that, we know perfectly well that the "lighter" drugs often leads to heavier drugs, wich causes deaths all the time, and of course permanent damage to your body.
My opinion, is that here in Denmark, teh weed should be legalized. Prefferably in a kind of coffeeshop or systembolaget way. Holland did it and they havent gone completly banana split... yet :) . It is already pretty easy to get teh weed her in Denmark, thank to glorious christania. I dont consider weed as dangerous, or at least not as dangerous as alcohol.
Am i right in saying some1 who has drinking, is generaly more violent, then somebody who has smoked a couple o joints.
:atat: I've been taking drugs for the past 3 years OCASIONALY. People u shouldn't make such a big deal out of something that isn't that bad. As long ur responsable enough to take things morderately and look after urself, then u usually have a good time:bdroid2:
Shannon Hoon, (lead singer of Blind Melon)
Layne Staley, (lead singer of Alice In Chains)
Rudolph Dwayne Goettell, (core member of Skinny Puppy)
Dude, I could fill 10 pages here in this post with dead peoples names, and not one of them died of drugs.
JM Qui-Gon Jinn
And at the last, I would just like to say a few words. If you make "lighter" drugs legal, then it is more likely that people will try them, yes? And if people try them, it is likely that they will do it again. And if they've done it two times, it is even more likely they will do it again, because if you use it, you'll get used to it, and it's not scary anymore, it's just "cool". So the drug users will do it more times. And more often. Often more drugs. And they will damage the brain beyond repair.This is an assumption of your own. Someone will do it again if they like it. They won't do it again just because they did it once. That makes no sense. And of course, people do lots of stupid things when using high amounts of these "lighter" drugs. I may mention an 11-year old girl who was killed by a person high on pot. The highness was the reason for the murder.Maybe you could also mention the court that allowed the defense attorney to use "high on pot" as a defense. Or is this another assumption as well? And not only that, we know perfectly well that the "lighter" drugs often leads to heavier drugs, wich causes deaths all the time, and of course permanent damage to your body."lighter" drugs don't lead to heavier drugs. You made that up, or are repeating crap made up by someone else. You can't assume everyone knows perfectly well a lie. Well, I guess you can, since you seem to assume alot of stuff. But someone who is trying to debate or prove a point can't use inane and obviously false information, unless you believe we are all retards or that this is some DARE seminar and we are all children.
XERXES
after using LSD the first time back when i was about 15 i could deffinately tell i had changed personality wise. I sensed the world in a different way that i was used to. Its weird.
I think I changed, at least in my head, after I took hallucinigens. I like to call it the opening of my third eye. A positive experience, everytime, in my belief. But not one I would recomend for someone who is young, as I think 15 is too young, but that is only my personal opinion.
Originally posted by munik
This is an assumption of your own. Someone will do it again if they like it. They won't do it again just because they did it once. That makes no sense.
If they have done it once, they won't be fearing doing it again. And again. And again. And again.
Maybe you could also mention the court that allowed the defense attorney to use "high on pot" as a defense. Or is this another assumption as well?
Luckily, in this country, being high is no defense in such cases. But we know perfectly well that it was the reason, however.
"lighter" drugs don't lead to heavier drugs. You made that up, or are repeating crap made up by someone else. You can't assume everyone knows perfectly well a lie. Well, I guess you can, since you seem to assume alot of stuff. But someone who is trying to debate or prove a point can't use inane and obviously false information, unless you believe we are all retards or that this is some DARE seminar and we are all children.
I have my information from people who have studied medicine for at least ten years. You have your "information" completely from what you want to belive, as you have nothing to back it up. Who is assuming things? Certainly not me. If you belive my information is false, then come with anything to back your statements instead of just saying "You are wrong, I am right". You belive precisely what you want to belive, and I can't change it. I have nothing to gain by telling lies, neither has the goverment. All the people I have seen that think all this is lies, have something to gain by doing that.
Yeah but when people OD all the time from drugs, it is not lies.
Originally posted by JM Qui-Gon Jinn
I have my information from people who have studied medicine for at least ten years. You have your "information" completely from what you want to belive, as you have nothing to back it up. Who is assuming things? Certainly not me. If you belive my information is false, then come with anything to back your statements instead of just saying "You are wrong, I am right". You belive precisely what you want to belive, and I can't change it. I have nothing to gain by telling lies, neither has the goverment. All the people I have seen that think all this is lies, have something to gain by doing that.
I never said I was right about anything. Just that you are wrong. As for having something to back it up, I already made a post stating the fallacy of "pot is a gateway drug" when you previously made this false statement. It takes a bold man to say I have nothing backing it up when anyone who has read this thread knows I already did that. I'm surprised that you actually want me to "back up" my refutations. You know, because you will never give us a reliable source for any of the garbage you post. Oh, you can say stuff like "thousands of doctors" and "studied medicine for at least ten years". But that doesn't show me anything. Give me a source, hell, lets go crazy and give me two reliable sources backing up any of the claims you make.
As I've said before, I'm not trying to prove to you that any drug is good. I'm just pointing out to those that you are preaching to that your information isn't entirely correct. If that bothers you, prove me wrong. Show everyone where, or rather who, you got this information from. 'Cause god knows you didn't gather this information yourself. In fact, you have nothing but second hand stories and no experiences to relate to us. You are a plethora of non-existant knowledge. It's like that game where everyone sits in a circle, and one person whispers a story into anothers ear, and then he turns to the next person and whispers the story, and so on. Then at the end the story gets told out loud, and then compared to the original, and everyone gets a laugh at all the mutations of it. You are nothing but a person in the middle, mutating the story as you pass it along.
You may have nothing to gain by telling lies, but that sure as sh*t isn't stopping you.
Both of you need to chill out right now.
That being said, I agree that both of you need to start hyperlinking some sources to back your arguments.
My experience comes from the people who have fallen around me. I lived with a girl that did drugs. I cleaned her up and helped her start over, then she fell into drugs again and now she is dead, and left a daughter behind. I think that is a reputible source enough. And alot of my favorite bands do drugs, and somebody always dies too. This is why I choose not to do them. If I die, I would rather get hit by a bus, or shot in the back of the head. I am not going to die, by showing others that I lost a battle to subtance abuse.
_Groovy
I have no argument to link to. I'm just pointing out errors by highliting the errouneous statements. I'm good like that.
I've known people who have died from drugs as well. I've known some scummy people who have done drugs, too. I am not saying that you are wrong for not doing drugs for this reason, just that in general this is not a very stable argument to not do drugs. People don't don't die from doing drugs the right way. It's called overdosing, not correctdosing. Drugs don't make you do anything, people make concious choices to do the scummy things they do when they take drugs. If you decide to put fault into whatever drug you were currently taking when you performed whatever stupid action you did, you were not mentally mature enough to take that drug. If you cannot accept responsiblity for your actions, not only are you too mentally immature to take any drugs, you most likely should not be allowed to function in society. So sayeth Munik.
Originally posted by munik
I have no argument to link to. I'm just pointing out errors by highliting the errouneous statements. I'm good like that.
I've known people who have died from drugs as well. I've known some scummy people who have done drugs, too. I am not saying that you are wrong for not doing drugs for this reason, just that in general this is not a very stable argument to not do drugs. People don't don't die from doing drugs the right way. It's called overdosing, not correctdosing. Drugs don't make you do anything, people make concious choices to do the scummy things they do when they take drugs. If you decide to put fault into whatever drug you were currently taking when you performed whatever stupid action you did, you were not mentally mature enough to take that drug. If you cannot accept responsiblity for your actions, not only are you too mentally immature to take any drugs, you most likely should not be allowed to function in society. So sayeth Munik. W3RD. munik knows quite a bit. the people that die are dead because, as in their medical reports, they overdosed on the drug. granted the hard drugs like cocaine and heroine are dangerous but only depending on how you take them. if you snort kool-aid your nose will bleed. its not the drug itself but the method and the amount you take. weed though isnt much of a harmful drug. its not as bad as people say. actually my friend who works at Parsons Medical College has done a study and it showed that if anything 4 cigarettes = 1 joint. (pure joint) many of the people that died smoking weed had joints laced with crack which is dangerous.
Dangerous, but oh so much fun.
Originally posted by munik
Dangerous, but oh so much fun. yeah kinda like driving or riding an airplane ;P
Originally posted by Darth Groovy
Yeah but when people OD all the time from drugs, it is not lies. when a person ODs on smack or crack or other drugs that you can OD on easily...its partilly the users fault. Yes I know that smack can kill you even the first time you use it...but it still has something to do with the user. Are they responsible enough to take only non-lethal doses, if they are dumb enough to snort lines of smack or meth or coke or whatever all night and OD on it...fine by me.
Most people who die when they are rolling (on X) it is because they are at a rave party or whatever...and their body becomes physically weak and dehydrated because they are rolling and they have all that energey or whatever i dunno.
Lots of other drugs you cant OD on, pot for example...youd have to smoke so much of it, it just becomes unrealistic, it just isnt possible.
my final word: if your gona use drugs...use them responsibly. please.
Originally posted by munik
I have no argument to link to. I'm just pointing out errors by highliting the errouneous statements. I'm good like that.
I've known people who have died from drugs as well. I've known some scummy people who have done drugs, too. I am not saying that you are wrong for not doing drugs for this reason, just that in general this is not a very stable argument to not do drugs. People don't don't die from doing drugs the right way. It's called overdosing, not correctdosing. Drugs don't make you do anything, people make concious choices to do the scummy things they do when they take drugs. If you decide to put fault into whatever drug you were currently taking when you performed whatever stupid action you did, you were not mentally mature enough to take that drug. If you cannot accept responsiblity for your actions, not only are you too mentally immature to take any drugs, you most likely should not be allowed to function in society. So sayeth Munik.
It is not like that vile of crack or tab of acid comes with directions on the back for correct dosage.
The Vikings used to dose heavily on ergot, a fungus that grows on trees. They would eat this stuff and piss it into a bowl and drink it, because it enhanced the effect of the dose.
Then they used to go on killing and raping sprees. Sound healthy to you?
Originally posted by JM Qui-Gon Jinn
http://www.teen-anon.iwarp.com/marijuana.htm)
http://www.newscientist.com/hottopics/marijuana/moreharmful.jsp)
http://www.newscientist.com/hottopics/marijuana/schizophrenia.jsp)
http://www.geocities.com/healthmoon/smoking-marijuana/diseases.htm)
http://library.thinkquest.org/J002597/marijuana.htm?tqskip1=1&tqtime=0331)
And especially this one:
http://www.amsa.org/resource/natlinit/marijuana.cfm)
http://www.erowid.org/psychoactives/psychoactives.shtml)
the real deal...seriously.
and befoer you go ranting on about how weed is bad...tobacco is just as bad (worse IMO), yet its legal.
http://www.homehealth-uk.com/medical/tobacco.htm)
What are the long-term effects of smoking tobacco?
Tobacco and smoking cause long-term damage to your health and can kill. Smoking causes chest problems, cancer, infertility and heart disease. Smoking may also lead to an earlier menopause.
Lung cancer is the cancer most associated with smoking. Lung cancer kills more people than any other type of cancer and at least 80% of these deaths are caused by smoking. However, there are other types of cancer, which can be caused by smoking, these include: cancer of the mouth, lip and throat, cervical cancer, anal cancer, pancreatic cancer, bladder cancer and leukaemia.
Tobacco contributes to at least 2000 limb amputations each year. Smoking will also raise your blood cholesterol levels and blood pressure and these 2 factors are the main 2 reasons why people get coronary heart disease. Smoking accounts for 30,000 heart disease deaths in the U.K. every year.
http://www.smith.edu/ourhealthourfutures/tobacco.html)
i may have smoked weed quite a lot in my past...but i am damn proud to say that i have never smoked a cigarette.
Originally posted by Darth Groovy
It is not like that vile of crack or tab of acid comes with directions on the back for correct dosage.
The Vikings used to dose heavily on ergot, a fungus that grows on trees. They would eat this stuff and piss it into a bowl and drink it, because it enhanced the effect of the dose.
Then they used to go on killing and raping sprees. Sound healthy to you? You're right, drugs don't come with directions. That doesn't mean a person is free of fault when they take too much. I learn about drugs before I take them. I search for information, and ask for information. I do not give anyone drugs without clear warnings of the effects, side effects, dosage, etc. If someone does not care about being informed of the drug they plan to take, then they do not care about any negative effects that may come from taking said drug. Ignorance is not an excuse.
As for your Vikings and ergot, sounds like a completely fabricated story. Without even verifying, just off the top of my head, I'm pretty sure that ergot is a mold that appears on rye bread. It is also a source of lsd-25. While eating moldy rye bread isn't a good idea to get stoned, it will most likely make you trip. But the negative side effects are not worth it, especially since it is much easier to buy lsd-25 in its isolated form. And as for drinking the piss, the only time I have ever heard of this is of eskimos(I know this isn't exact) in northern asia maybe that eat the fly agaric mushroom. They then drink their piss because the chemical that gets them high does so by altering something in the brain, then that chemical passes out of the system. So drinking your piss would be like taking another dose. But in the real world, people can just go and buy or get another dose, it's not necessary to drink your own piss. Also, one shouldn't eat the fly agaric, it's dangerous.
XERXES, I am an avid reader of the vaults of erowid, but I won't put the link here as I know most people who disagree with me won't believe what's there. Shared knowledge regarding drugs is a great source for clearing up any ignorance, but when you have been brainwashed your whole life it is hard to change, and only those who are above the level of sheep will be enlightened.
Originally posted by munik
XERXES, I am an avid reader of the vaults of erowid, but I won't put the link here as I know most people who disagree with me won't believe what's there. Shared knowledge regarding drugs is a great source for clearing up any ignorance, but when you have been brainwashed your whole life it is hard to change, and only those who are above the level of sheep will be enlightened.
http://www.neoicaria.com/~steve/bowdown.gif)
Originally posted by XERXES
http://www.erowid.org/psychoactives/psychoactives.shtml)
the real deal...seriously.
and befoer you go ranting on about how weed is bad...tobacco is just as bad (worse IMO), yet its legal.
http://www.homehealth-uk.com/medical/tobacco.htm)
http://www.smith.edu/ourhealthourfutures/tobacco.html)
i may have smoked weed quite a lot in my past...but i am damn proud to say that i have never smoked a cigarette.
I do belive tobacco should be banned anyway. But marijuana is worse:
"Marijuana cigarettes contain four to five times as much of certain cancer-causing substances as tobacco cigarettes. "
"As marijuana is inhaled and held in the lungs, repeated use can damage the lungs and heart. Marijuana users may have many of the same respiratory problems that tobacco smokers have, such as chronic bronchitis and inflamed sinuses. While all of the long-term effects of marijuana use are not yet known, there are studies showing serious health concerns. For example, a group of scientists in California examined the health status of 450 daily smokers of marijuana but not tobacco. They found that the marijuana smokers had more sick days and more doctor visits for respiratory problems and other types of illness than did a similar group who did not smoke either substance. As to long-term effects of marijuana use, findings so far show that the regular use of marijuana or THC may play a role in cancer and problems in the respiratory, immune, and nervous systems."
"Smoking marijuana causes some changes in the brain that are like those caused by cocaine, heroin, and alcohol. Some researchers believe that these changes may put a person more at risk of becoming addicted to other drugs, such as cocaine or heroin. Long-term studies of high school students and their patterns of drug use show that very few young people use other illegal drugs without first trying marijuana. For example, the risk of using cocaine is 104 times greater for those who have tried marijuana than for those who have never tried it. Using marijuana puts children and teens in contact with people who are users and sellers of other drugs. So there is more of a risk that a marijuana user will be exposed to and urged to try more drugs."
"Many researchers fear that marijuana damages brain cells, and the long-term effects are still being researched. In laboratory research, scientists found that high doses of THC given to young rats caused a loss of brain cells such as that seen with aging. At 11 or 12 months of age (about half their normal life span), the rats' brains looked like those of animals in old age. It is not known whether a similar effect occurs in humans. Researchers are still learning about the many ways that marijuana could affect the brain."
"Scientists do not yet know how the use of marijuana relates to mental illness. Some researchers in Sweden report that regular, long-term intake of THC (from cannabis) can increase the risk of developing certain mental diseases, such as schizophrenia. Others maintain that regular marijuana use can lead to chronic anxiety, personality disturbances, and depression. Some frequent, long-term marijuana users show signs of a lack of motivation (amotivational syndrome). Their problems include not caring about what happens in their lives, no desire to work regularly, fatigue, and a lack of concern about how they look. As a result of these symptoms, some users tend to perform poorly in school or at work."
"Marijuana has adverse effects on many of the skills for driving a car. Driving while high can lead to car accidents. This is because marijuana affects many skills required for safe driving: alertness, the ability to concentrate, coordination, and reaction time. These effects can last up to 24 hours after smoking marijuana. Marijuana use can make it difficult to judge distances and react to signals and sounds on the road. There is data showing that marijuana can play an important role in crashes. When users combine marijuana with alcohol, as they often do, the hazards of driving can be more severe than with either drug alone.
A study of patients in a shock-trauma unit who had been in traffic accidents revealed that 15 percent of those who had been driving a car or motorcycle had been smoking marijuana, and another 17 percent had both THC and alcohol in their blood. In one study conducted in Memphis, TN, researchers found that, of 150 reckless drivers who were tested for drugs at the arrest scene, 33 percent tested positive for marijuana, and 12 percent tested positive for both marijuana and cocaine. Data also show that while smoking marijuana, people show the same lack of coordination on standard "drunk driver" tests as do people who have had too much to drink."
"Doctors advise pregnant women not to use any drugs because they might harm the growing fetus. One animal study has linked marijuana use to loss of the fetus very early in pregnancy. Some scientific studies have found that babies born to marijuana users were shorter, weighed less, and had smaller head sizes than those born to mothers who did not use the drug. Smaller babies are more likely to develop health problems. Other scientists have found effects of marijuana that resemble the features of fetal alcohol syndrome. There are also research findings that show nervous system problems in children of
mothers who smoked marijuana.
Researchers are not certain whether a newborn baby's health problems, if they are caused by marijuana, will continue as the child grows. Preliminary research shows that children born to mothers who used marijuana regularly during pregnancy may have trouble concentrating. When a nursing mother uses marijuana, some of the THC is passed to the baby in her breast milk. This is a matter for concern, since the THC in the mother's milk is much more concentrated than that in the mother's blood. One study has shown that the use of marijuana by a mother during the first month of breastfeeding can impair the infant's motor development (control of muscle movement)."
And especially note this: "For example, the risk of using cocaine is 104 times greater for those who have tried marijuana than for those who have never tried it.". Not leading to harder drugs, eh?
And especially note this: "For example, the risk of using cocaine is 104 times greater for those who have tried marijuana than for those who have never tried it.". Not leading to harder drugs, eh?
Nope, not leading to harder drugs. It's simply the easiest drug to get, and one of the first that people try. Before trying coke, almost every user tried pot. But most people who smoke pot don't try coke.
I'm not good at getting my point across through text.... but a nerd isn't going to try coke. It'll be someone who is connected to drugs somehow, and who doesn't have a problem with breaking the law or doing drugs. This person will likely have tried pot first because it's more easily available. This doesn't mean that most people who smoke pot will do coke.
Its funny that you think you know everything about something you've never done.
Originally posted by JM Qui-Gon Jinn
I do belive tobacco should be banned anyway. But marijuana is worse:
"Marijuana cigarettes contain four to five times as much of certain cancer-causing substances as tobacco cigarettes. "
So one joint is equal to four cigarettes regarding cancer? So, if on average I smoke 10 cigarettes a day(I do), then I would have to smoke 2 1/2 joints a day as well to equal the cancer causing effects. In reality, I smoke a half a joint about every three days. Which would be equal to smoking 2 cigarettes every three days. So, if I smoked one, or none, cigarattes a day, I would hardly consider myself a smoker. At risk for cancer, sure, but not something that would be considered. What I'm saying is that most people don't smoke joints every hour or so. So the effect of maybe getting cancer from weed is so miniscule that it's not much to worry about.
Most of your paragraphs are filled with speculation, or opinion, and most of the tests were done on animals, not humans. I don't see any studies that are named, or any doctors. Just because you put quotation marks around the paragraphs does not mean those are reliable statements. For all we know you could have just typed those off the top of your head (but I know for sure that you didn't, as those paragraphs are filled with uncertain words, and I'm sure you would embellish with statements overflowing in surety). I could just copy/paste your post, and alter the paragraphs to the positive, and that should be equally as reliable, right?
Originally posted by munik
Most of your paragraphs are filled with speculation, or opinion, and most of the tests were done on animals, not humans. I don't see any studies that are named, or any doctors. Just because you put quotation marks around the paragraphs does not mean those are reliable statements. For all we know you could have just typed those off the top of your head (but I know for sure that you didn't, as those paragraphs are filled with uncertain words, and I'm sure you would embellish with statements overflowing in surety). I could just copy/paste your post, and alter the paragraphs to the positive, and that should be equally as reliable, right?
I took them from this site:
http://www.amsa.org/resource/natlinit/marijuana.cfm)
Surely, the American Medical Student Association is more reliable than your non-excisting sources, is it not?
Ok, let me say this once again for you. I do not have any sources because I am not making any claims that need sources. I am merely pointing out the fallacy in your statements by using either A: The ability to see that most of your statements can be proven false by logic alone, and B: My own experience, which gives me the knowledge that you do not possess.
Now, as I have never heard of the American Medical Student Association before, I decided to check out that link. That article was written by Melisse Leung, a pre med student. She does not list any sources for the few studies she alludes to. It is no more then an opinion piece, a far cry from a real conclusive article. The AMSA is a student orginization that has chapters at many colleges. One of their prime goals is politcal activism. (
http://www.amsa.org/member/recruiting_faqs.cfm) Basically encouraging the idealogy of it's student members.
Also, I found this on the AMSA website in the Preamble Purposes and Principles Regarding Use of Illegal Drugs, Alcohol and Tobacco (
http://www.amsa.org/about/ppp/):
1. SUPPORTS the legislation of cannabis as a Schedule II drug for emperically validated medicinal
use in the most effective form for the individual; (1999)
2. SUPPORTS the legalization of cannabis for medicinal use in the most effective form for the
individual. (1999)
Doesn't sound like the AMSA has too much of a problem with marijuana.
I also find that an opinion article written by a college student that is posted on the website of a student orginization for political activism to hardly be a reliable source. There is in fact no support that I could find by the AMSA regarding Melisse Leung's article. This is just another example of you latching on to someone else's ideals and attempting to use them as support for your own twisted agenda against drug use.
Originally posted by munik
You're right, drugs don't come with directions. That doesn't mean a person is free of fault when they take too much. I learn about drugs before I take them. I search for information, and ask for information. I do not give anyone drugs without clear warnings of the effects, side effects, dosage, etc. If someone does not care about being informed of the drug they plan to take, then they do not care about any negative effects that may come from taking said drug. Ignorance is not an excuse.
As for your Vikings and ergot, sounds like a completely fabricated story. Without even verifying, just off the top of my head, I'm pretty sure that ergot is a mold that appears on rye bread. It is also a source of lsd-25. While eating moldy rye bread isn't a good idea to get stoned, it will most likely make you trip. But the negative side effects are not worth it, especially since it is much easier to buy lsd-25 in its isolated form. And as for drinking the piss, the only time I have ever heard of this is of eskimos(I know this isn't exact) in northern asia maybe that eat the fly agaric mushroom. They then drink their piss because the chemical that gets them high does so by altering something in the brain, then that chemical passes out of the system. So drinking your piss would be like taking another dose. But in the real world, people can just go and buy or get another dose, it's not necessary to drink your own piss. Also, one shouldn't eat the fly agaric, it's dangerous.
XERXES, I am an avid reader of the vaults of erowid, but I won't put the link here as I know most people who disagree with me won't believe what's there. Shared knowledge regarding drugs is a great source for clearing up any ignorance, but when you have been brainwashed your whole life it is hard to change, and only those who are above the level of sheep will be enlightened.
Well, that would explain why I could not find a good link. I do remember my Biology professor telling that to us last semester, but I have called him on an error a few times.
I stand correct.
Well it seems this post is dead. Munik pwned the antidrug side.
Hey! Slavery was abolished a long time ago, last time I checked... -C'
I had three friends who got into pot from there older brothers. One friend gave it to the other friend and they got addicted, then we were at a strip mall at night and they started to light up, i declined because I didnt want my mom to smell smoke on my shirt, it was the best decision i have made in my whole pathetic life, because the next day there parents caught them, then a week later our school found out about it, our school has a low tolerance for drugs, and they got expelled immediately. Now two are clean, and the other is addicted to cigs, marijuana can ruin good people.
I had three friends who got into pot from there older brothers. One friend gave it to the other friend and they got addicted, then we were at a strip mall at night and they started to light up, i declined because I didnt want my mom to smell smoke on my shirt, it was the best decision i have made in my whole pathetic life, because the next day there parents caught them, then a week later our school found out about it, our school has a low tolerance for drugs, and they got expelled immediately. Now two are clean, and the other is addicted to cigs, marijuana can ruin good people.
Sorry your friends got busted, yeah marijuana prohibition sucks. Also sorry your friend is smoking cigs.. dumb thing to do.
Originally posted by Kinnopio?
Well it seems this post is dead. Munik pwned the antidrug side.
:lol:
Ok, let me say this once again for you. I do not have any sources because I am not making any claims that need sources.
So basically, if I said the world is round, and you said that it isn't, then you'd be right because you're "not making any claims that need sources"? Seems pretty odd to me.
I am merely pointing out the fallacy in your statements by using either A: The ability to see that most of your statements can be proven false by logic alone,
Hehe, tell me more about this one, this will be fun to hear.
and B: My own experience, which gives me the knowledge that you do not possess.
Your own experience does not give you more knowledge on the long-term damages of marijuana.
Also, I found this on the AMSA website in the Preamble Purposes and Principles Regarding Use of Illegal Drugs, Alcohol and Tobacco:
1. SUPPORTS the legislation of cannabis as a Schedule II drug for emperically validated medicinal
use in the most effective form for the individual; (1999)
2. SUPPORTS the legalization of cannabis for medicinal use in the most effective form for the
individual. (1999)
So, they support cannabis for medical use, not private. I do not, however, since there are medicines that are just as effective as cannabis.
I also find that an opinion article written by a college student that is posted on the website of a student orginization for political activism to hardly be a reliable source. There is in fact no support that I could find by the AMSA regarding Melisse Leung's article. This is just another example of you latching on to someone else's ideals and attempting to use them as support for your own twisted agenda against drug use.
Well, if people were to pick that much on internet sites, no sites would be any reliable.
Nevertheless, the sources I give to you are much better than the sources you won't give me.