Thats what I'm saying. Times are changing, its likely that the government will look different after years of unprecedented peace time. I'll try to clear up the Chief of State thing though. When it was Mon Mothma, she went by Chief of State. When Leia took over, she also took the title of Chief of State. When Leia took a leave of absence, Ponc Gavrisom took the title of President. My assumption is that President is something of a temporary title.
that doesnt explain the ever changing shifts in the New Republics military structure or the senates coninuous changes. face it, the EU has coninuity errors like all series :D
of course it has continuity errors. i'm not disputing that by any means. but you make it sound like there is something particularly bad in this book, so I was trying to address that. there is not as much continuity error as you might think. a lot of what appears to be inconsistent, can actually be rationalized.
and some of it is explained in books 2-8 ;)
Originally posted by Shok_Tinoktin
and some of it is explained in books 2-8 ;)
yeah Leper, who died and made you chief of Lucasbooks continuity.... :P stiff shyte, read the book, enjoy the story/or not and try for at least once, if that is at all possible for someone of your intellectual talents, to make some comments worthy of discussing, rather than whine about $hitty little things like that in an absolutely HUGE and awesome book....(and series mind you) :p :) ;)
*goes back to laugh at other threads where leper is starting to grate on people* :p it is so wonderfully obvious you are from the UK, btw :D here in aus, the favoured descriptor is "whingin pom" :p
mtfbwya
Originally posted by Astrotoy7
yeah Leper, who died and made you chief of Lucasbooks continuity.... :P stiff shyte, read the book, enjoy the story/or not and try for at least once, if that is at all possible for someone of your intellectual talents, to make some comments worthy of discussing, rather than whine about $hitty little things like that in an absolutely HUGE and awesome book....(and series mind you) :p :) ;)
*goes back to laugh at other threads where leper is starting to grate on people* :p it is so wonderfully obvious you are from the UK, btw :D here in aus, the favoured descriptor is "whingin pom" :p
mtfbwya
oh dear, took that a bit seriously didnt we? :p
i have quite enough "intellectual talents" to judge the book im reading, but i havnt done that yet, ive just stated my impressions so far. I havnt got to the end yet and im still giving it a chance, all im sayin so far is i find the constant restructuring of the New Republic government quite distracting in the entire EU, not just this book.
Well I just finish vector prime not to long a go and I fought it was great but it needed more combat.
Originally posted by Cyborgninja
Well I just finish vector prime not to long a go and I fought it was great but it needed more combat.
the cheif plot point i didnt like about Vector Prime was that it ended with the Republic winning the battle, it hardly seemed the best way to introduce this enemy that would procede to invade and conquer most of the galaxy. Other than that, i thought Chewbacca's death was poor, i felt certain he would die in actual combat, as it seemed the only fitting way to go. Maybe it was a suprise move but it just, well, wasnt very good.
But if he died in combat, then someone would have to be a better warrior than him. The way it was, it took an entire moon to take him down. Don't get me wrong though, NJO has its share of poor deaths.
Originally posted by Leper Messiah
the cheif plot point i didnt like about Vector Prime was that it ended with the Republic winning the battle, it hardly seemed the best way to introduce this enemy that would procede to invade and conquer most of the galaxy. Other than that, i thought Chewbacca's death was poor, i felt certain he would die in actual combat, as it seemed the only fitting way to go. Maybe it was a suprise move but it just, well, wasnt very good.
Chewies death was a sacrifice. His life for anakins. It also set up for a whole new dynamic between Han Solo, who quickly loses the plot, and anakin...Both are deeply haunted by Chewies death, not the least anakin, who shares alot of guilt and grief over it :(
it was an interesting, and perhaps the only way to have allowed the authors to explore Hans fall to the emotional depths he did..... it was a brave move on the part of NJO authors, and the fact that "immortalised" characters arent actually immortal is a comforting thing to know in the EU...otherwise it would become boring very quickly :)
mtfbwya
ok im gettin through Star By Star slowly (ive got a lot of work to do atm) and the battle of Coruscant has just begun and Anakin has just snuffed it.
on the subject of Anakins death: excellent, very well done to the author, now that is the way Chewie should have gone down. I was a little sad to see Anakin go, I was hoping Jacen or Jaina would die, both have annoyed me throughout their presence in the EU, Anakin was a much better character than they are.
Originally posted by Leper Messiah
ok im gettin through Star By Star slowly (ive got a lot of work to do atm) and the battle of Coruscant has just begun and Anakin has just snuffed it.
on the subject of Anakins death: excellent, very well done to the author, now that is the way Chewie should have gone down. I was a little sad to see Anakin go, I was hoping Jacen or Jaina would die, both have annoyed me throughout their presence in the EU, Anakin was a much better character than they are.
that's the thing. Anakin was a well liked character by many. His loss allowed the author(s) to reflect on each of the characters, summarising how each has responded differently in a time of turmoil. It also helped crystallise the jedi cause I believe, and possibly make things a *little* easier for Luke, who was starting to encounter an increasing amount of division within the ranks of the jedi
keep reading ! SBS is cool....but nothing like TUF, which is an absolutely awesome finale...DaMMIT! I wish they would hurry with those post NJO novels...Im getting sick of the clone wars era stuff :(
mtfbwya
Does the Republic retake Coruscant? and what happens there while the Vong control it?
also ive got as far as Jaina and a few of the other Jedi going to stop the Vong from keeping Anakins body, and i liked the fact that Jaina used a dark side power, does she go any further down that route, because that would make her character far less annoying to me :D
Originally posted by Leper Messiah
Does the Republic retake Coruscant? and what happens there while the Vong control it?
also ive got as far as Jaina and a few of the other Jedi going to stop the Vong from keeping Anakins body, and i liked the fact that Jaina used a dark side power, does she go any further down that route, because that would make her character far less annoying to me :D
Man ! why dont you just read the books. What the Vong do to coruscant is awesome and horrifying ! As for the republic retaking ? it..... READ "THE UNIFYING FORCE" :p !
mtfbwya
because i dont have time! look how long its taken me to get through Star By Star :D
I started reading the NJO recently and actely enjoyed it despite the death of some main characters. Bt then I starteded reading Star by Star. I just doesn't seem to fit as well as the rest of the NJO does. Is there anybody else who thinks this?
One of the books in the New Jedi order series haven't you heard of them?
yer ive seen them and i knwo bout em, but not star by star
Hmm.... SBS is one of the greatest books in the NJO.... That crazy metallica fan Leper is reading it right now as well, and there is a thread here where he tells us all about it :( :p
http://www.lucasforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=140223)
mtfbwya
It's just not written as well and it seems out of place
Originally posted by Samnmax221
It's just not written as well and it seems out of place
how far into it are you ??
had you read the preceding books ??
SBS can be a bit ofverwhelming....alot is going on. I remember reading it over a cpl months duration, rather than a few weeks. Made all the epic events even more huge in my mind :p
good luck with it, hey if you dont end up gettin into it, return it and get Survivors Quest :D :p
mtfbwya
Actually, I thought Star by Star fit the series like a glove; without spoiling anything it's definitely the Empire Strikes Back of the saga. It's a lot to take in, though; a lot of different plots are running in a lot of different directions. However, in my opinion, this adds to it rather than detracts, particularly given that it was Troy Denning's first venture into writing novels for the SW universe - no small task to be given SbS, trust me.
Ignore that last comment by Astro: good luck with it, hey if you dont end up gettin into it, return it and get Survivors Quest. He's got something against Tim Zahn... but even I'll admit that SQ was not the best of the SW books I've read. Just wait till you're around the end, you'll find you love SbS.
Originally posted by Master_Keralys
...Ignore that last comment by Astro: . He's got something against Tim Zahn... but even I'll admit that SQ was not the best of the SW books I've read. Just wait till you're around the end, you'll find you love SbS.
Hey ! I wasnt being sarcastic ! I just thought that if he cant enjoy SBS then he shouldnt bother with the NJO and stick to something familiar, like Zahn and his *groan* over-recycled and over-used themes... yep, cool in 1990. But c'mon its 15 damn years onward now ! (and 20 in EU years !!!!) :p
mtfbwya
ok, finished Star By Star a litle while ago, and it wasnt awful, but i dont think it was awesome, Coruscant falling should have really merited its own book, i was dissapointed with how it took second place to the voxyn storyline, allthough Anakins death was an excellent piece of writing. Compared to Chewie's death, it was far far better. Actually reading this book i felt Chewie could have quite feasibly died fighting Tsavong Lah, and i maintain my disappointment with the way that he died. Star By Star was good in many places though, i enjoyed Borsk Fey'la's death - scheming to the last :D and what i did find promising was the rising of the dark side in Jaina towards the end - an interesting twist to a character i previously found rather boring (of the 3 solo children the one that died was the only one i liked). i cant be too critical of Star By Star though because i bought and read the next book in the series, Dark Journey, so SBS must have done its job.
Dark Journey was fairly enjoyable, I was disappointed Jaina didnt go further down the dark path and she seems at the end of the book to be recovering from her near fall. The swiftly deteriorating battle over Coruscant at the start was my favorite sequence of the planets fall, particularly the pilot who notes with horror that Coruscants lights were going out, a very powerful image in my view. im undecided whether to continue reading the series, what is the next book? and more importantly is it any good?
The next book is Rebel Dawn, which is the first half of the Enemy Lines duology. As far as how good it is, I'm the wrong person to ask. I don't care for Aaron Allston's writing style, but most people do. Of course, if you do finish Enemy Lines, then you will be ready for Traitor, one of the best SW books in existence.
I actuely enjoyed rebel dawn (Yes I managed to read through 3 more books since my last post) I liked the trickery and subterfuge that Allston added.
actually the book is rebel dream :p
was reading it today and i hit upon the first reference i didnt understand since i picked up the NJO at Star By Star. Luke says he named the Twin Suns squadron in memory of Tatooine, so has Tatooine been destroyed?
Originally posted by Leper Messiah
actually the book is rebel dream :p
was reading it today and i hit upon the first reference i didnt understand since i picked up the NJO at Star By Star. Luke says he named the Twin Suns squadron in memory of Tatooine, so has Tatooine been destroyed?
no, it hasnt !! [/quick simple answer]
mtfbwya
well whats "in memory" all about
It is in his memory, as in he remembers it.
why named in memory then, why not named for? seems an odd phrasing
in memory of his childhood there mostly. it was about his memory, not its memory.
fair enough. bloody ambiguous jedi masters, I knew there was a reason i preferred Kyp
Originally posted by Leper Messiah
fair enough. bloody ambiguous jedi masters, I knew there was a reason i preferred Kyp
heh....this coming from a person who doesnt like brats :p
sing a long a la 'Men In Tights'
We're Kyp's - Dozen Jedi Knights !
We roam around the galaxy looking for fights !
:p
mtfbwya
We maaaayy look like paaaaantiiiiiees ..... :D
yes but Kyp has a redeeming quality - he can annoy Jaina at will :D
Originally posted by Leper Messiah
yes but Kyp has a redeeming quality - he can annoy Jaina at will :D
Jaina trembles every time Kyp walks in, but she prefers the non-threatening Jag....
I can definitely see Jaina and Kyp hooking up eventually. It makes sense, especially with Kyps connection to Han. Any kids they have will surely be quite kickass as potential jedi, and be able to give Ben Skywalker an a$$ kickin if he deserves it :p
mtfbwya
Originally posted by Astrotoy7
Jaina trembles every time Kyp walks in, but she prefers the non-threatening Jag....
I can definitely see Jaina and Kyp hooking up eventually. It makes sense, especially with Kyps connection to Han. Any kids they have will surely be quite kickass as potential jedi, and be able to give Ben Skywalker an a$$ kickin if he deserves it :p
mtfbwya
Id be very disappointed with Kyp if he did but i could see it happening after the very inevitable death of Jag Fel.
oh and Ben Skywalker = odds on favorite to kill Luke
Originally posted by Astrotoy7
and be able to give Ben Skywalker an a$$ kickin if he deserves it :p
Someone better.
Originally posted by Leper Messiah
oh and Ben Skywalker = odds on favorite to kill Luke
I dunno about that. from the looks of things, no one is gonna kill Luke.
Originally posted by Shok_Tinoktin
Someone better
I dunno about that. from the looks of things, no one is gonna kill Luke.
No child of Jaina Solo is likely to be a character i tolerate for long unless it comes out lightsaber weilding, sith to the bone and takes her and a room full of people out :D
Luke has to die at some point, old age would be a shockingly terrible way for the hero of the whole story to die. And besides Mara Jade is hardly the sort of character that grows old peacefully so he'd just be a loner for the rest of his days which would be pretty rubbish. Get him killed off by Ben (who will undoubtedly knock some young lass up before he turns bad thus setting the whole ugly thing in motion again :D) in fact Luke could do the Obi-Wan surrender to Vader and disappear and continue to turn up as a ghost every now and again
yes i agree that someone should kill luke, i just dont agree that someone will kill luke. GL seems to be against it, and that makes it hard for it to happen.
well it cant really be a passing EU villain of the week (or even an EU villain of the 19-book series for that matter) It needs to be a prominent member of the permanent EU cast. Of those, not many possiblities exist to my mind. I would have thought Anakin Solo a possibility before he died, but Ben Skywalker seems to be the most plausible person to be powerful and skillful enough. I guess Kyp could at a push or Jaina/Jacen but they dont seem to have the necessary presence in the story. Mara could but it would make no sense for her character to be sent back in that direction so the newborn Skywalker seems the best candidate, if as you say anyone does kill Luke.
i also give 2/1 odds that Ben Skywalker will not make it through life without having a hand severed in a lightsaber duel.
yes. it would be roXXorrzz for Ben to turn out as scum :D But I dont see it happenin....
Luke will prolly do a sacrifice himself thing, like Ben Kenobi....
mtfbwya
Doesn't everyone turn out as scum? As far as killing Luke though, thats something else.
Originally posted by Shok_Tinoktin
Doesn't everyone turn out as scum? As far as killing Luke though, thats something else.
hey...you can hardly call our boy jacen scum... kyp, yes :D
mtfbwya
Kyle and Corran > both. :)
Originally posted by Astrotoy7
hey...you can hardly call our boy jacen scum...
Yeah, for the most part. But when he first gets the force back from Vergere, you have to admitt he loses it a bit for a little while.
I thought that whole "I won't use the Force" stage was pretty obnoxuise
Originally posted by Samnmax221
I thought that whole "I won't use the Force" stage was pretty obnoxuise
well, one related point is that Jacen is very much like his mother in many respects. In essence she has rejected/neglected the force for most part...
mtfbwya
Well it was still well after planet of twilight it looked like she might go on to use the force more but didn't