Taking a cue from a recent TheForce.net thread on 'What would make you walk of Episode III', I was wondering whet would trigger people to walk away without finishing the [SP] game.
The only game since 1996 (not counting demos) I stopped playing without finishing was Unreal II. I can't say Elite Force II was better than Unreal II, but it certainly kept me playing, probably due to good use of Star Trek assets.
Here are a few thoughts:
- Poor saber combat. I mean poor - worse than the original Jedi Knight, which was cool enough at the time just for the fact of giving us the saber.
- Endless waves of mindless enemies - like mine crabs! I don't mind a section of them (but could do without them) but I want to out-think my enemies. ... of course, I finished Elite Force II despite it having endless waves of mindless enemies.
- Lots of Ysalimari weilders or Yuuzhan Vong - I don't want to be reduced to a guy with a glowing sword, active and passive force powers are a big part for me.
... well, I hope others do better - I just can't see very much that would stop me playing through - #3 won't happen, #2 will disappoint me but I've already proved it won't stop me, and #1 is contrary to the entire focus of the game.
Mike
Hmm, I suppose if it'd be one thing that would make me quit the game and not return to it for a while, it'd have to be... (Bear with me.. it's been a while since i've played JO)
** Cheap Dark Jedi enemies. or a CPU that cheats too much. Good GOD they can be cheap. It irritates me to have an awesome saber duel going just to get force-choked and then hit in the back with a saberthrow while frantically hitting the Force Push button.
** For a cheating example, have you ever faced down one of Desann's shadowtrooper guys while an AT-ST is shooting at you? In an enclosed Area? I have. And whenever the AT-ST shoots a rocket, the Shadowtrooper can SOMEHOW MAGICALLY Force-Push up to FIFTY TIMES IN A ROW. Not to mention that if you AREN'T in an enclosed area, those force pushes can knock you halfway across the map. (Try Yavin_Canyon. Gets really irritating there.)
** Or a boss like Desann, who cheats so overtly it's rediculous. Completely immune to Force Choke, while he can choke/zap you with lightning/Saberthrow ALL AT ONCE! Wohoo for overgrown Kowakian monkey-lizards! But then, all you have to do is turn on Force Speed and whack him 4-5 times to kill him in 9/10 battles. Please, no comically mismatched/unbalanced bosses.
** A bad guy that says, "Join me, and let's blahblahblah"
Really, It's not as if i played through the whole game just to be a sidekick to some stupid Darque Jedi. This is STAR WARS for crying out loud. Not THE ODD COUPLE.
heh heh... dessann was a bit dumb...
With FPS games there is almost nothing that will stop me playing through them.... mainly because they are so short. Even with annoying ones i tend to find myself thinking "just another hour or two and i can finish this and uninstall it!!"
The ONLY thing that might stop me would be an annoying sudden failure level that i had to replay over and over and over again.... but usually that isnt an issue on PC games due to the free-form saving.
However, just cos i finish it doesn't always mean i like it :D
With other genres it is usually just a case of boredom if the game goes on too long and doesn't have a story that captivates me. I have loads of RTS games (some that are really good) that i just haven't ever gotten around to finishing because they take so long and something else comes up and distracts me.
So, i'll finish it whatever... however whether i keep it or uninstall and ebay it is another matter... :D
Well...if characters randomly started to flick me off...or if they started cussing onscreen...or if the plot is about a tragic accident which transplants Luke's and Kyle's heads onto the bodies of Twi'lek females...then I would probably run like the wind, away, far away...[/shudder]
If Jar Jar Binks and the Ewoks BOTH are involved in major story points. Also, if Kyle dies I will be a bit ticked. One more thing below ***SPOILERS***
Another thing would be if they make Boba Fett cheesy, and YES, HE IS IN THE GAME. I know this because of info from someone playing LEGALLY at Comic Con, not because of any illegal copies, which I refuse to even see screenshots from. If Boba Fett fights a jedi and the jedi has a lightsaber, he should be able to give them a run for their money. I don't want to just have to run in circles deflecting a few shots to win. Boba did well vs Luke and Jango kick Obi Wan's butt, so Boba BETTER be able to handle a jedi apprentice or two. :D
see how great the spoiler tag looks? Use it next time!
Originally posted by Darth Vicious
CPU that cheats too much.
Cheater AI ... arrrgggghhhh! The WORST example of that has got to be the MoHAA 'Sniper Alley' level! Most games these days do it ... JO was better than most in that regard, actually. Sad - because what you said is true, plus the snipers, and others who knew you were there. But - MoHAA (also Spearhead), SoFII, RtCW ... they were all worse in terms of cheater AI - MUCH worse. Elite Force II didn't have any AI, so ... ;) (I really have to stop dinging EFII ... I did like it ...)
Originally posted by toms
The ONLY thing that might stop me would be an annoying sudden failure level that i had to replay over and over and over again.... but usually that isnt an issue on PC games due to the free-form saving.
There's a fine line between finding that type of thing a challenge and just plain annoying. Elite Force II again - you have to stop a warp core breach. It is really tight time wise, and your 'friendly NPC' is as useful as ... well, I just wish I had either Lando or even that R5 at my side instead. But at least it made sense - if you don't make it the ship blows up.
Imagine this instead - Lando dies, and so you can't get the ship going. Once Lando dies you can't quick-save, and Reelo starts with the blast gun and sending wave after wave of his henchmen against you ... you fight valiantly, and maybe take out Reelo ... the New Republic will remember your bravery ;)
Or with the R5 - he gets destroyed, so you can't get through the door - you can go back, but they've disabled the elevator ... so you're stuck in the hallway where various enemies come to take pot-shots at you ... maybe as you die Lando is calling "kyle? Kyle? Oh spast ...".
My point - if the ship blows up you will die, but if you lose the droid ... well, you'll fail that way too, but not by kneeling down head in hands.
Mike
Originally posted by BoL_Stryke
If Jar Jar Binks and the Ewoks BOTH are involved in major story points. Also, if Kyle dies. SPOILERS BELOW
OK, I'm going to shout now ...
THERE"S A F*CKING SPOILER TAG FOR A REASON YOU A**HOLE!!!
OK, I'm done - seriously, though, haven't there been enough warnings about talking about the warez copies? And if you don't work for Raven/LA, you are not legal in having a copy yet, and you shouldn't be talking about plot points that are not announced by Raven/LA.
Mike
It's so easy, a child could do it.
Check the vb code below:
Simplex est!
So easy! Just some brackets around the word SPOILER and the same after, with a backslash before the S. Start using it!
I was in a hurry. I just didn't think about the spoiler tag. My apologies. Now, with that said, please don't flame me like that. I did not say anything about warez. My info comes from other sources, I do not and will not have this game until its release (Sept. 16 as it stands now) Please do not be so fast to assume that I know something because I downloaded some illegal version. :mad: Remember what they say when you assume...
*EDIT* and txa, your post contradicts itself. If I shouldn't talk about anything that has not been OFFICIALLY said by the developers, then why use a spoiler tag. Spoilers are usually considered things that have not been officially confirmed yet. And don't call me a F*CKING A**HOLE again, that's just not polite :D
* Too many god damn stupid puzzles that make absolutely no sense and are there solely for the sake of puzzles.
* Too many stupid show-stoppers... like putting a single crate into the game that (unlike all the other 27.000 indestructable & identical crates you've ran across) you can and must destroy with weapon X in order to make it to the next level.
Wow. I haven't flamed anyone on these boards yet but I'm going to have to make an exception. This level of boneheaded stupidity deserves retaliation. If I was a mod I would ban you on the spot.
You ****ing idiot.
Do you know how much time some people have invested discussing in a spoiler free fashion and anticipating this game?
Oh, and here's a tip... if you want to make a real apology, which we all deserve, don't try to backpedal your way out of in the next sentence. No one cares if the information was from a friend of a friend's mother's cousin's sister's aunt who played the beta build to the end. PLOT POINTS ARE UNLIKELY TO CHANGE.
Also, mods, please edit out the IF KYLE DIES part of his post... the fact that prefaces the spoilers gives cause for concern.
Yeah, I'm done.
Originally posted by BoL_Stryke
*EDIT* and txa, your post contradicts itself. If I shouldn't talk about anything that has not been OFFICIALLY said by the developers, then why use a spoiler tag. Spoilers are usually considered things that have not been officially confirmed yet. And don't call me a F*CKING A**HOLE again, that's just not polite :D
I know I wasn't polite ... I apologize to you for that, but I don't think I was contradictory - I was saying the same thing two different ways. You didn't do a real spoiler alert, so you were openly discussing spoilers which I saw right away because of the way the forum scrolls to first unread. Had you done a true spoiler tag ... I wouldn't have gotten upset and used inappropriate language and yelled ...
It is very frustrating for me, as a very honest person, to see so many people coming along with intimate knowledge of what is going on in an unreleased product, either from direct or indirect sources. I don't assume you have a copy, but there have been very specific instructions to not talk in these forums about things from these illegal copies of the game - so we shouldn't have to deal with it ...
Mike
the only time i will stop play jedi outcast and jedi academy is when hell freezes over.:) :D :p :cool:
As for Sargasso, you deserve no response, save for this: read my sig for further info-You read after it said spoiler, that is none of my concern. Now, with that said, once again, this info came in no way from the beta build at all. This info came from someone who LEGALLY played the game at Comic Con (I think that is what it was-one of those conventions) The only thing I did wrong was forgetting to use the tag, which Kurgan quickly fixed. (Thanks by the way) Notice my original post never even MENTIONED any illegal stuff. Now we really should stop bickering, because this is getting too far off the topic.
Originally posted by BoL_Stryke
Now we really should stop bickering, because this is getting too far off the topic.
A very good point.
*uses Force Finger-Wag*
Stop bickering! Er...please. :D
Back on topic...
The only things that would make me stop playing Jedi Academy are show-stopping bugs (the Lando bug in JO was a real kicker that prevented me from finishing the game for a while until I knew what was wrong), or encountering one of those really annoying points in a game where they throw everything at you in a bottleneck, and you have to keep reloading until you find the right strategy to get past it. If you die and have to reload more than a few times in a row on the same section, then that's just bad game design, IMHO. The only other thing that might stop me playing is if it just becomes tedious due to lots of little glitches, and lots of spawning enemies. From what I've seen and read so far, though, I don't think that's going to happen with this game. ;)
Originally posted by StormHammer
The only things that would make me stop playing Jedi Academy are show-stopping bugs (the Lando bug in JO was a real kicker that prevented me from finishing the game for a while until I knew what was wrong)
That was tricky ... because it wasn't widespread. The JO SP game was one of the least buggy in recent years at release. But I agree - having a game that makes you fight tto be able to play it is a real joy-killer.
If you die and have to reload more than a few times in a row on the same section, then that's just bad game design, IMHO. Or you're just too lousy a player to get through it ;) (hate when that happens to me ... MotS level 5!) Seriously that is poor game design - either by having near impossible insta-fail, or just making the base level too hard for new players.
Mike
I got some more-
-A 3PO unit as the main boss
-Desann's great-great grandfather as a Jedi Trainer
-R2-D2 with a lightsaber
-Finding out the game code was mixed up with other LF games and I was really holding Obi-wan for X-Box
-the Borg
*Note- even if I eventually started playing again, I would sure be put off by these.
** MAZES INSTEAD OF LEVELS. That irks me to no end to run around for an hour or two in an imperial facility or garbage disposal area that is really nothing but a maze, as opposed to the facility it portrays.
Belch.
I'm gonna repeat a few of the others on my list but here's my list of total turn-offs if they will be in JA:
*ANOTHER BOSS LIKE DESANN! As I have said before on previous posts, give me a challenging saber fighter like Jerec instead of an uber-Force lamer like Desann. I want a final boss that acts intelligently and will attempt to avoid my saber moves, like backflipping out of the way, and have excellent defense instead of having an insanely high health meter. I don't want a final boss who's saber attack is so high that it blasts through my defense and kills me in one good hit. I don't want a final boss that can kill me in two seconds with ridiculously overpowered Force powers, like gripping me and hurling me into a wall or gripping me and blasting me with lightning.
*PUTTING THE YUZZHAN VONG INTO THE GAME! This won't happen (thank the Lord!) but it would've been a horrible addition to the series. The Vong have NEVER belonged in the Star Wars universe, and I will never, NEVER accept them.
*IF THE MAIN BAD GUY IS A DEAD SPIRIT/CLONE! This one irks me. The clone way would be the pulp sci-fi way out. Clones wouldn't necessarily have the same Force sensitivity as the original host because they would be raised in a different environment. As for spirits, they have never affected anything in the physical world in the movies. All Obi Wan could do was advise Luke on the right path to go. Therefore, the Sith counterparts would be similarly limited, reduced to advising beings rather than attacking them. I believe that a spirit cannot be revived. I believe that the Dark side of the Force simply chooses another being to continue the dark legacy. I also believe that the living can not harm the dead and vice versa. If I had to fight a Sith clone/revived spirit, I would walk away in disgust.
That's about all I can think of for now. I'll post later if I think of any more.
Insanely stupid NPC's. Including enemies and allies. Most annoying thing is keeping allies alive that run right into your saber or *try* to get killed. Smarter enemies would provide more of a challenge as well, not just increasing their aim.
-DRUDRIG :mob: